NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY – PROFILE: Kristin Chenoweth: Finding Love and Listening Harder

LONG ISLAND WOMAN INTERVIEW – Kristin Chenoweth

Exclusive Interview with Kristin Chenoweth: Finding Love and Listening Harder 

by David Lefkowitz

((c)2022 David Lefkowitz. This profile was first published in the April/May 2022 issue of Long Island Woman magazine)

It’s fair to say that for everyone, no matter their age, profession, or station in life, the past several months have served as a time of reflection and reassessment. Certainly, for artists in the entertainment industry, the two years of COVID resulted in everything from creative pivoting (e.g., from live performances to virtual productions) to leaving the business for other careers. 

Given her level of success, Kristin Chenoweth, the Tony-winning actress who 23 years ago burst onto the entertainment firmament playing Sally in You’re a Good Man, Charlie Brown, followed by an iconic turn as the “popular” witch of Wicked, was spared such a drastic moment of reckoning. Nevertheless, the isolation of the pandemic, the drying up of Broadway work, and changes in the industry’s treatment of women and other underrepresented societal groups have caused her to set off in different creative directions and make unexpected life choices, even as she expects concerts, musicals, and television work to pick up steam. (Already this year she’s had a clutch of tour dates and in 2021 reaffirmed her diva street cred by co-starring in the Apple TV hit, Schmigadoon!.) Finding the time to write again, as she did when she penned her highly enjoyable 2009 memoir, A Little Bit Wicked, the actress realized she had a new story to tell: one that incorporated both her love of pets and personal background as an adoptee.

What Will I Do with My Love Today?, a children’s book about a little girl asking herself that question and realizing that bringing a dog into her life will be the answer, hit shelves and Kindles last month, via Harper Collins Christian Publishing. In conceiving the work, Chenoweth asked herself a different, albeit related question: “How can I show who I am and be positive in this dark world?” In our mid-winter Zoom conversation, the actress explained, “During the pandemic, I wondered what I would do with myself. I can’t touch, I can’t breathe, I can’t do all the things we’re naturally supposed to be able to do. 

“I was also thinking about a book on adoption and being there for each other,” added Chenoweth. “And then my dog, Thunderpup, was just looking up at me one day, and I realized, `Hello! That’s the title of the book!’ It’s Kristin and Thunder going across Manhattan — and my parents are in it, too.” 

Asked about publishing under an explicitly Christian imprint, the proudly religious actress noted, “The book is not really faith-based; it’s about conquering your fears and gaining confidence and unconditional love.” Chenoweth then chuckled and added that the above description could, indeed, be construed as “faith-based,” though she’s currently at work on a more overtly Christian and inspirational piece. “I wouldn’t say it’s a sequel to A Little Bit Wicked. It’s more about what I’ve learned through the hard times.” Among those setbacks — a number of ended relationships, the passing of an old friend, and getting clonked on the head by a piece of lighting equipment when she was shooting The Good Wife, leading to months recovering from a concussion — yet no relief from the migraines she’s suffered since her twenties. For the former Miss OCU and second-runner-up for Miss Oklahoma, life has not been a bowl of chenos.

“I talk to a lot of my young mentees when I do master classes,” she said. “They want to know, `How do you deal with your problems, your stress? How do you quiet your mind?’

Chenoweth paused. “I thought we had it hard back in the day, but kids today face things that are really difficult. Even before the pandemic. Social media is a blessing and a curse — the comparisons that they have to make to each other and the immediate response. A lot of my younger friends will say, `You didn’t text me back until this morning! Are you okay?’ And I’m, like, `I’m fine. I just don’t live and die by my phone.’ But they do. So that immediacy, things happening so quickly. And the feeling that they have to use filters to show themselves. I mean, sure, I still wanna look good; I’m not kidding anybody. But I also want them to know that life has things like injury, sickness, loss. That’s when we have to rely on faith — which doesn’t necessarily mean Christianity. Whatever their higher power is. 

“So it’s been a joy writing the second book,” Chenoweth added. “I’m not Shakespeare, I’m not perfect. It’s just simple and it’s me. There are deep thoughts that happened there in this COVID, and I think every person has said, `How’m I gonna deal with this?’ When I lost my best friend [Tulsa realtor John Sawyer], who was like a brother to me since I was 16, I thought, `Hey, God. Are you there? `Cause I don’t see you.’ There was anger and questioning — which I believe God wants us to do because we’re thinking people. (That may be very un-Southern-like of me to say.) But in the still of the night does come peace, if you listen. I say this a lot lately, though I never paid attention to it before: `We’ve got two ears and one mouth; listen harder, speak less.’ That’s brought me to my knees.

“Even with the BLM movement,” Chenoweth continued, “it’s been so important to listen. To listen. To see people where they are in their lives. To accept — not just tolerate but accept and love people where they are in their lives. I’m not patting myself on the back; I’m no saint — even if the perception of me is rainbows, glitter, happy all the time. What I want to share in my books and everything I write and sing — especially now — is…it’s not perfect. Nobody has `the perfect.’ I don’t care how much money you have or don’t have. Of course money makes life easier, but it doesn’t take away the problems, it doesn’t take away depression or darkness, and it doesn’t take away the things that we contemplate. So with this time of silence, I’ve heard a lot of things that I maybe couldn’t hear before. Listen harder, speak less.”

That said, Chenoweth has been speaking — as a spokesperson — for the “Less Red, More You” campaign by Rosacea Awareness, sharing her experiences battling the reddening skin condition, and she’s spoken openly about spending half her life enduring excruciating migraines — a product of her having Meniere’s disease, a disorder of the inner ear. “So that comes with both migraines and tinnitus,” the actress sighed. “I’m convinced Van Gogh cut off his ear because he had that.

“The night I won an Emmy for Pushing Daisies, with all the cameras flashing and the excitement, I was headed to the party. I looked at my manager and got the black dots and `kaleidoscope eyes.’ The next thing you know, I’m sick. That takes the fun out of life. Also, migraines suck because, to quote Madeline Kahn in Clue, `Flames! Flames on the side of my face.’ You’re on fire. But because it’s inside our ear and in our head, people go, `Oh, she just has a bad headache.’ The way I describe a migraine is: if you’re drinking a Coke, and you get a brain freeze for a few seconds, that’s a migraine — only it doesn’t go away.”

So the actress is forever careful about such triggers as alcohol, chocolate, caffeine, salt, and lack of sleep. “I have to sleep on an incline,” she said, “and not fly so much. All the things i know I have to do. I mean, lights affect me — and I live and die by the spotlight. Sometimes I’m doing everything right and it still happens.” 

Botox has been a blessing, Chenoweth noted, that has literally spared her from having to retire. She said the treatment is particularly effective when injected into pressure points on her head. Gesturing to her face, the 53-year-old actress joked that she also uses Botox “in other areas that I enjoy.” 

Like every actress who has moved past the ingenue stage, Chenoweth feels the tug of time on her life and career — but age didn’t deter country-rock musician Josh Bryant, 13 years her senior, from popping the question last October. Said Chenoweth, “I always used to joke, `Oh, it’s time for me to put my fiancé to bed’ or `Let me tell you who ABBA is!’ But these are just jokes. He’ll tell me all the time, `You’re beautiful. Stop talking about the way you’re gonna age. I don’t even see age.’ I’ll say, `But when I’m 65, you’re gonna be 53. How do you feel about that?’ He’s like, ’You look young, and you’re a young spirit.” He makes me feel confident. And what’s so fun about being with someone so much younger is that we’re both learning from each other. Like, he can do anything with tech; I can’t. It’s a miracle that I’m on this Zoom [call]. He’s the one that put it in and got me on here. So I will tell him how things were in the beginning, with jobs and auditioning and how the business has changed. And we learn from each other.

“My mom said to Josh at Christmas,” continued Chenoweth, “‘Are you ready to marry an old lady?’ I went, `Mom, I’m sittin’ right here.’ She was just giving us a hard time. But he is an old soul. He tells me all the time, `age is a number. Who cares?’ He’s right.”

Chenoweth also noted that, like her, Bryant is an open-minded Christian. “I always thought,” she explained, “that you can be with somebody that doesn’t believe like you. But now that I’ve found someone who is of like mind and spirit, I realize that’s much more important than I thought. Josh and I are different, but when it comes right down to it, we’d probably make similar decisions. He’s a musician, so we meet on that level. And he’s not mad at me for being who I am. He wants to celebrate and lift me up. I’m a dichotomy in so many ways, and he’s like that, too. So it just works, and I adore him.”

The diminutive star, whose dating history includes actors Seth Green and Marc Kudisch and writer-producer Aaron Sorkin, realized that until her current fiancé, she had been “running away from” commitment her whole life. “I was a late bloomer and wasn’t ready,” she said. “I’m so independent, so I was always, `I got this! I’m on mah own! I make my own money! I don’t need your name! I’m tough!’ And, just speaking honestly, I’ve had men in my life who’ve let me down. I’d think, `I don’t know if I trust you.’ (Let me be clear: I’ve also had wonderful men in my life.) But they say when you meet “the person,” you know. I always thought that was a bunch of hogwash (as we say in the South). But now I’m definitely the girl who says, `When you know, you know. Run toward it. Let somebody in.’”

Of course, as evidenced by What Will I Do with My Love Today?, Kristin Chenoweth already has practice letting someone in and sharing love unconditionally. That partner would be the aforementioned Thunderpup, her ridiculously photogenic four-legged friend since 2017. A brown ball of fluff, Thunder was DNA tested and came up 25 percent Shih Tzu, 25% Cocker Spaniel, 12.5 percent miniature poodle, 12.5 percent Norwegian Elkhound, and 25 percent mutt. As with men, the actress proceeded with caution before embarking on a new canine relationship. “When my first dog, Madeline Kahn Chenoweth, passed away, I thought, `I’m never doing this again. I don’t want to feel this pain,” she said. “But I’m a dog person. And about six months after, I kept passing this rescue place in L.A., being drawn there, feeling, `you need to go there. Your dog is there. YOUR DOG IS THERE.’ 

“In true Mama Rose fashion,” continued the actress, “I had a dream, and Maddie was in it. She looked at me as if to say, `Girl, it’s time. It’s okay. I’m good.’ For me, as an adopted person, it just makes sense to go rescue an animal. So I went into the rescue center, Thunder saw me, came right up to me, and barked at me. I thought, `She’s telling me I’m hers.’ 

“I’m in a business that’s very self-self-self,” concluded Chenoweth. “A dog takes the emphasis off that — even when they’ve seen it all: the good, the bad, and the ugly. She makes me happy every day.” 

Which is surely the best thing to do with love.

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SIDEBAR: 

CHATTING WITH CHENO

So have you and Josh set a date?

We kind of go back and forth, but don’t be surprised if we just run off and do it.

Do you and he fight over the remote?

He’s learned not to fight with me. And he’s now a fan of all the Housewives. Plus we binge shows like Ozark and watch every single documentary, from true crime to David Foster. 

What book are you reading?

I’m in the middle of The Sleep Fix (by Diane Macedo). Director Richard Jay-Alexander sent me the book because besides migraines, I have insomnia. I’ve taken all the natural herbs I can. I’ve taken Ambien. So I don’t know if the book is going to help — you know, “turn off your phone, don’t lie in bed and watch TV” — that stuff.    

Do you have a favorite joke?

The famous thing about me is that I love comedy, but I am the worst joke teller. I mean, I’ll screw up, `Knock knock. Who’s there? Olive you. Olive who…’ See? I screwed it up. I DON’T TELL JOKES. 

Favorite biblical quotation?

From Proverbs: “Seek and you shall find. Knock and the door will open.” It’s a lesson in patience. 

Favorite Painter?

Edgar Degas. Especially his ballet dancers. That era, and the use of color. 

If you could have dinner with any historical personage — besides Jesus — it would be…?

Leonard Bernstein. The Maestro himself.  

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BYLINE:
David Lefkowitz is an award-winning playwright whose short comedies, Restoration Playhouse, and Three Percent, were both produced virtually in theater festivals in 2021. His podcast, Dave’s Gone By (davesgoneby.com) recently began its 20th season. 

–> https://wp.me/pzvIo-2hJ

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NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY PROFILE: Jane Fonda: Opening Up and Speaking Out

JANE FONDA: OPENING UP AND SPEAKING OUT

by David Lefkowitz

(This article was first published in Long Island Woman magazine, March 2020.)

Does Jane Fonda contradict herself? Very well, she contradicts herself. After all, this is an actress who began her career with a Tony-winning turn on Broadway but then gained stardom playing hookers and babes in such films as Walk on the Wild Side, Circle of Love, and Barbarella. This is also a woman who championed exercise as the best way to stave off aging but later succumbed to Hollywood’s plastic-surgery siren call. A woman who bought into her famous dad’s patriotic values and yet committed diplomatic acts that bordered on treason. A woman who became a feminist symbol but was frequently and willingly caught in the spell of powerful men. Oh, and a woman who renounced the trappings of L.A. and materialism only to marry billionaire mogul Ted Turner. 

She is also a woman who has made a career—in the notoriously amnesic entertainment industry—last six full decades and counting. If you didn’t know Jane Fonda as the vivacious newlywed smooching Robert Redford in Barefoot in the Park, you knew her as the scarified prostitute in Klute. You cried when she interacted with papa Henry in On Golden Pond and laughed watching her gain office empowerment in 9 to 5. And if you missed her arc on The Newsroom, surely you’ve seen her camaraderie with Lily Tomlin on Grace and Frankie, now airing its sixth season (and shooting its seventh) on Netflix.

Shapeshifting plus longevity equals an endlessly fascinating personality, one that Fonda herself delved into in her 2005 memoir, My Life So Far and that HBO recounted in its recent documentary, Jane Fonda: A Life in Five Acts. Having reached the age of 82, the actress is readier than ever to offer frank assessments of her life choices, career cul-de-sacs, and political stances. She even tours occasionally, doing live Q&A/life-overview concerts (though a December 2019 stint at Westbury’s NYCB Theater was canceled without explanation). Fonda has taken hits, sometimes deservedly, for thoughtless public gestures, but her five arrests for protesting climate change attest to a decades-long yearning to make her celebrity voice count for something.

To be sure, she knows well the double standard often placed on women who speak their minds versus men who do the same. As she notes in her book, when husband Turner opined, the press would call him passionate. When she’d do it, she was branded as “strident and shrill”—as evidenced by a Life Magazine article about her that was titled “Non-Stop Activist: Nag, Nag Nag.” Of course, to modern eyes, that sounds more like a badge of honor than a knock.

“I’m an open-upper,” she told Long Island Woman in our late autumn conversation. “I’ve done a lot of the public speaking by now, and it tends to be a lot of fun—often revelatory. I think it’s fair to say the audiences always leave having had a very good time and maybe having learned a few things. I try to be helpful; I think being honest is being helpful. I mean, why talk about yourself if you’re not gonna open up and be real? All of us women have had the same struggle, the same challenges—and many men, as well. So you have to tell the truth.”

Even those who see hypocrisy in Fonda’s actions—be it promoting peace by riding a North Vietnamese anti-aircraft gun or having work done despite being the icon of video exercise—will likely be disarmed by her frankness and confessional style. She has long apologized for the horrid optics of the Hanoi Jane photo, and in 2018 she told Vanity Fair that, like it or not, plastic surgery gave her “a decade more to survive in the business” of Hollywood. To this, she added, “I have a fake hip and a fake knee and a fake thumb. Just call me the Bionic Woman!” 

Asked by Long Island Woman what she has learned about herself by doing the documentary and speaking tours, Fonda deadpans, “Nothing. When I wrote my memoirs, that was where I really uncovered things about myself that I hadn’t realized. I had turned 60 and was looking at my last act, so I spent time studying the past.”

In directing her film about Fonda, Susan Lacy chose to partition the actress’s life into five acts—four of them marked by her being under the sway of a powerful man, be it father Henry Fonda or ex-husbands Roger Vadim, Tom Hayden, and mogul Ted Turner. But now that she’s in her most independent era, Fonda chafes at the movie’s structure. “Personally, I divide my life into three acts: The first 30 years, the second 30 years, and the last 30 years. I couldn’t know how to live my last 30 years if I hadn’t known what I had done in the first 30 years. So I spent five years researching my life, my parents, my grandparents. And that process taught me a great deal. So when it came time to do the documentary or the speaking, no, I’m not learning during that time. I’m teaching.”

As the movie makes clear, for all her manning of political and feminist barricades, Fonda often defined herself in terms of powerful men: pleasing an unreachable dad, fitting into Vadim’s hedonistic lifestyle, pouring her time and money into Hayden’s campaigning, and being swept off her feet by Turner’s bonhomie. Yet whether by Lacy’s conception or Fonda’s own, the last segment is about the actress alone. “Because of the work I did to write my book,” Fonda says, “I certainly understand myself better at this age. I have had two other important relationships [since her divorce from Turner], but I realize that’s no longer for me. I have a whole lot more time to devote to other things now that I’m not in a relationship and know that I never will be in a relationship again with a man.

I have lots of relationships but they’re not romantic, they’re friendships.”

No question, Fonda is entitled to have complicated feelings about the male-female dynamic. Her mother, a victim of sexual abuse, committed suicide when Fonda was 12, and the actress herself experienced both childhood sexual trauma and rape as an adult. For her, the “Woke” era is long overdue, and she offers a snarky laugh when I suggest that the era has become so sensitive to harassment, men must be super-careful in their interactions with women. “Super-careful?,” she chortles, “No, men just have to behave like decent human beings. If that means being super-careful, that’s very interesting because it says a lot about men. Hopefully, the `Time’s Up’/`Me Too’ movement will help men regain their humanity and realize that they’re not entitled to treat women however they want. More women are speaking up—which helps other people to realize how pervasive sexism—including violent sexual assault—is, and that’s all to the good.

We are human beings together on this planet, and we have to respect each other. The movements are a good, important step forward in the journey to that goal.”

It is this idea of looking backward and inward, of figuring out how you arrived where you are and how best to get wherever you might be going, that seems to be most crucial to Fonda’s psyche these days. As she told NPR, “You don’t become wise by having a lot of experience; you become wise by reflecting deeply on the experiences that you’ve had.”

Put another way, having newly embraced Christianity and her own efficacy as a woman, Fonda ends her 2005 autobiography by owning and appreciating, “Every earned line on my skin and scar on my heart . . . I can affirm every imperfection as my share of our mutual, flawed, fragile humanity.”

Those who have seen the HBO documentary know that the actress is not above giving herself the occasional pep talk, addressing herself by her last name and dispensing no-nonsense self-recommendations. It is what she does when I ask what she would tell her 20-year-old self if given the opportunity to go back and advise young Jane. “It’s gonna be a tough road, Fonda!” comes the reply. “Keep your head up and your eyes open, and know that if you are intentional about getting better and braver and stronger, then you can. So don’t give up.”

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BYLINE:

David Lefkowitz hosts the Dave’s Gone By show Saturday mornings live on Facebook (facebook.com/radiodavelefkowitz). He is co-author of musical comedy Shalom Dammit!

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NOTES & BACKSTORY:

This one was a grind, not because Fonda was in any way difficult, but I had only 10 minutes with her on the telephone, of which the first minute was introduction and two other minutes were fairly specific about her upcoming gig at Westbury—which was canceled a week later. In other words, my job was to spin 1500 words out of seven minutes. Eat your heart out, Cameron Crowe.

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NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY PROFILE: In Bloom: Marcia Gay Harden Writes a Memoir for her Mother

In Bloom: Marcia Gay Harden Writes a Memoir for her Mother

by David Lefkowitz

(This article was published in the Nov. 2018 issue of Long Island Woman)

 

“How is your mom doing?”

That is the central question—the one everyone who reads Marcia Gay Harden’s book, The Seasons of My Mother: A Memoir of Love, Family, and Flowers, will want to ask her. It’s also the question she considers daily.

Beverly Bushfield Harden was diagnosed with Alzheimer’s and has been deteriorating, bit by bit, ever since. Watching the woman who raised her slowly disappear has turned Marcia into an advocate for Alzheimer’s research, as well as a reflective and lyrical writer as she shares her own story intertwined with her mom’s best years and later decline. In fact, Seasons was originally going to be a mother-daughter collaboration on a coffee-table volume celebrating Mrs. Harden’s mastery of ikebana, the delicate arrangements of flowers. Instead, it turned into the daughter’s autobiography, covering her years as a budding actress, her success in such projects as Miller’s Crossing, Meet Joe Black, and Pollock (Supporting Actress Oscar); the landmark original Broadway production of Angels in America; TV’s Law & Order:SVU and Code Black; her marriage and divorce from film location scout and prop master Thaddaeus Scheel, the loss of her niece and nephew in a 2004 fire, and the raising of her children as a single parent while balancing a full slate of film and television work.

And yet, we return to the simple question, “How is your mom doing?”

“I wanna say she’s the same,” replies the actress, chatting by cell phone as she is on her way to take her actress daughter, Julitta, out for a celebratory dinner on the occasion of the 14-year-old having wrapped shooting on a new Jim Carrey TV project. “I can’t say anything good about Alzheimer’s. It’s a progressive disease that has robbed her. She’s still pleasant; she’ll always be kind and pleasant. But it’s only a nod towards her tenacious spirit that she is still those things. And I’d be lying if I said, `Oh, that makes me feel comforted. At least there’s the essence of mom.’ There’s just the essence, not the actions, the communication. When you talk to a person who has Alzheimer’s at the late stage she does, it’s a fairly one-way conversation, and it’s sad.”

Asked what she wishes more people knew about the disease, Harden points to Seth Rogan’s “Hilarity for Charity” organization and his Senate testimony before the Senate four years ago. “He said, `First you think—not that Alzheimer’s is charming, but it’s small.’ You think, `Ehh, they forget where they put their keys. They forgot a couple of faces.’ But the diagnosis is really like an avalanche. It’s a snowball tumbling down the hill creating devastation in its path.”

That said, Harden agrees with many experts that lifestyle choices can affect or impede the onset of dementia. “From what I understand from the research, they’re the common-sense things: exercise to the point that you sweat, eat well, and avoid or cut out sugar and carbohydrates—which has completely changed the line-up of my pantry!” she laughs.

More seriously, the actress, though acknowledging the complicated nature of Alzheimer’s and the failure of drugs to help, ascribes to the “gut-brain connection” theory, which again points to lifestyle: “There’s a reason some call the disease `Diabetes 3,’” she notes. “We need less inflammation in our bodies and, therefore, less in the brain. Initially, people talked about tau and tangles, but we all have tangles. Something’s blocking the ability to empty them. And at this point, I’ll do whatever I can to stave it off, because as I watch what happened to my mother and to other people, `exercise’ for them is playing with scarves, so to speak, and they completely lose the ability to control their bodily functions. So anything we can do, we should do.”

Which, of course, leads her to call for more research—especially in relation to Alzheimer’s and women: “Why are two-thirds of the people getting it women? Maybe if we study women, we can understand what occurs hormonally at a certain age. Anything we can study, we need to study to find a cure.”

Granted, unlike other grown children faced with similar parental health crises, Harden’s acting success has allowed her, for the time being, to keep her mother at home rather than in a facility. Even so, coordinating caregiving is always a challenge. “I have two sisters who go down and visit,” Harden explains. “My brother visits occasionally, and I visit when I can.”

All three siblings have read Harden’s book, “respect it, and are thrilled that it’s this love story to our mother,” Harden adds, “but they do they different responses and don’t always remember things the same way I do. We’ve had a few conversations on the order of `no, that wasn’t the car she drove’ or `mom would never have liked that.’ And I’ve just had to say that I understand we all have different stories and memories. I mean, when police interview people who’ve witnessed a crime, there are 15 different perspectives. It’s the same way in a family. But my family is proud of it and hopes the book will make a difference in Alzheimer’s awareness—especially the stigma.

“In fact, the last chapter, `Star Navigator,’ talks about when I was doing Angels in America,” Harden recalls. “During that time, the AIDS community was just breaking the bubble of shrouding who had AIDS in shame. By doing that, they really galvanized and showed us a way to lead in research and in conquering a disease. We must do that with the Alzheimer’s community because they can’t speak for themselves. My mom can’t be a spokesperson. But now, more and more, people living with Alzheimer’s are being voices and faces for the disease. They’re helping change the tide of how we talk about it.”

Asked if writing the memoir gave her perspective on her own life, Harden points to “maturity” as the biggest takeaway. “Going through the many different things I’ve gone through in the last 20, 30 years changed me. At the time, I was a bit green and raw. But, of course, in life, we grow up, we change, we control. Things that bothered me then or that I’d stand on a soapbox for, or my desire to be right—those wane, to a degree, with maturity. You choose your battles. Even the passions of life. I’m still incredibly passionate about the things I do. But the passionate expression changes as we get older. Perspective is a very interesting educator. It certainly educated me.”

Also teaching Harden—in terms of her first literary effort—was her friend, screenwriter Alvin Sargent (Ordinary People, Julia). “Early on,” the actress explains, “my publisher, Atria, recognized that I write in a way that they say is “lyric” and told me I should just listen to that voice. Alvin would say, `stop thinking about it and let it go! Let your brain go where your thoughts are taking you.’ That was really helpful to allow myself to move forward. I mean, I know enough not to put too many adjectives in the same sentence—anybody who’s taken writing in college knows that. But it was a pleasure to discover my voice, and I wonder if I wrote something different, would I write in a different style? That will be interesting to find out for me because actors often get dismissed as being vain, uneducated people whose opinions don’t count. But when you write a book, maybe you can’t be dismissed as readily. That remains to be seen!”

Although Seasons of My Mother changed from a glossy how-to volume about flower arranging to a personal narrative, Harden chose to keep to a floral theme: “I’d think, in January, what were the flowers mom would use? But rather than linear—January, February, etc.—it became seasonal. And the flowers were always there because they were always there for her.”

 What has always been there for Marcia, from her first appearances in Kojak and Simon & Simon episodes thirty years ago through her role as Grace Grey in all three Fifty Shades movies, is the work. “It’s been a wonderful life for me,” acknowledges. “But I tell my daughter, `don’t be a red-carpet actress. If you’re gonna act, be a real actress.’ My son Hudson, also an actor, loves musical theater, while Julitta loves film and television. But I want her to do theater, too, because that’s where you really hone a lot of skills. Theater actors can be film actors, but film actors can have a very tough time going into theater.”

Harden’s last Broadway role was her Tony-winning turn in God of Carnage nearly a decade ago, but Hollywood still beckons. “After three seasons, Code Black was cancelled,” she says, “so I recently booked an action movie called Point Blank. It’s a kind of character I’ve never played before—a very complicated cop—so I’m excited. I’m also working on some projects of my own because I love television. I love the daily-ness of it, the stories where you don’t know where it’s going, and all of a sudden it changes and the character grows—even if it’s sometimes tough not being in charge of your character. It makes me think of when I was playing Claire in Damages. You assume you know your character, but then the writer gets a whim and wants to up the stakes. So you start as an innocent flower girl, and now you’re a mass murderer!”

Harden is a big believer in researching roles, especially since some of her best known parts—Lee Krasner in Pollock, Ava Gardner in 1992’s telepic Sinatra—were real people. “You want to research the times they lived in, the customs, their mental processes,” she notes. “And that’s a gift because the accent, the stride, the behavior, the attitude—those have to be so specific. And yet, you still bring yourself into it. There’s only one you. Watch the greats—like Meryl Streep, who transforms in everything she does, yet there’s a core of Streepness about it. Actresses like her—Judi Dench, Ellen Burstyn, Nicole Kidman—always bring their touch of humanity to the work.”

Since she brings up acting superstars and legends, it’s only fair to ask Harden about some of the notables with whom she has shared the screen. For example, Diane Keaton, Goldie Hawn, and Bette Midler in 1996’s The First Wives Club. “Oh, that was so long ago,” Harden sighs. “I mostly worked with Diane Keaton. She always wore headphones and was listening to music to get herself in the mood. I will tell you that the moment in the film when she hit me in the head was a mistake; she wasn’t supposed to actually hit me. But she blasted me—100 percent real! Still, back then I was really just a girl sitting in a chair and watching the greats work.”

A year later, Harden would co-star with Robin Williams in Flubber—a memory that instantly makes her laugh. “Loudest set you’ll ever be on in your life!,” she recalls. “Robin was always entertaining the crew and making jokes. You were thrilled when the director called `Cut!’ because that’s when Robin would begin his one-man show. And when they’d say `Action!’ again, he’d be so inventive and bringing what wasn’t on the page to the page. It was really buoyant for me.”

Not surprisingly, back then there was little hint of the demons that would surface for Williams two decades hence. “He was shy in certain ways and incredibly generous,” Harden continues. “And when he was quiet, he was quiet. In those times, you want to make sure that everything’s okay, but really they’re resting. You don’t disturb that. And Robin and I did have one-on-one, deep conversations. But mostly it was seeing his mind working; that was so exciting.”

Harden felt excitement of a different kind appearing with Brad Pitt in Meet Joe Black.

“He was so beautiful!” she gushes. “Couldn’t take my eyes off him. I was thrilled when he noticed my cleavage in one scene! But I found him to be an incredibly classy person. He was going through different things in his private life at the time and breaking up with Gwyneth, but he was just very classy, and his family was there—including his mother—so he was just all-American and respectful of the process of acting and bringing his work to the plate.”

Romance taking a back seat to work has also been Harden’s story the past few years. She’s still single and not exactly looking. “There’s not a lot of interest or great candidates at the moment,” she confesses. “Plus, I’ve got a lot going on, so I’m not really around and available. Now, if the right person came along, great. But I’m deliriously satisfied and incredibly content with the rich, beautiful life I lead. My friends are great, and romance could be fun, but I’m okay at the moment not sharing a sink with anybody!”

 

*

SIDEBAR:

Since flowers are so integral to Marcia Gay Harden’s book, we thought we’d get her quickie impressions of various blooming beauties:

Roses

I think of English gardens and Valentine’s Day. I like wild roses. Store-bought roses are beautiful, but they wilt so damn quickly.

Hyacinths

The aroma is heavenly. They’re an early bloomer. It’s like a jiggling lady.

Daffodils / Jonquils

I’ll always think of them as “a little lady wearing a perky bonnet,” as my mother described them. Or Katharine Hepburn. They grow wild in Vermont, and my ex put hundreds of jonquils on my car when he was first courting me. When I told my mother this story, she said, “Oh, daffodils. The happiest flower in the garden.” I was thrilled that she made the connection that daffodils and jonquils are the same flower.

Tulips

They’re fantastic. They’re spring to me. One can’t help but think of Holland and the fields and fields and fields of them.

Hibiscuses

They’re like a piece of thin, thin, paper. Very delicate.

Irises

A lakeside lover. Little purple ones that bloom by the lake. They make me think of a dark night because they’re purple and edged in black, but then they get lighter until the center is yellow. They’re a dramatic sunset. Like when you look at one side of the sky and you see the sun setting, but the other side is already night.

Orchids

There’s an odd sterility about an orchid. It’s very exotic and delicate and enticing, but without an aroma. You put a white orchid in a home, and it’s immediately elegant.

Amaryllises

Very sexual.

Stargazer Lilies

It’s big and white and aromatic. It’s often in hotel lobbies, so you walk in and you get this beautiful, fresh smell. Instant elegance. My favorite flower.

*

BYLINE:

David Lefkowitz is an adjunct professor of English at the University of Northern Colorado. He also co-publishes Performing Arts Insider (TotalTheater.com) and hosts Dave’s Gone By (davesgoneby.com) live on Saturday mornings (facebook.com/radiodavelefkowitz).

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NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY PROFILE: It’s a Wonder-ful Life: Lynda Carter on Music, Money, and That Role

IT’S A WONDER-FUL LIFE: Lynda Carter on Music, Money, and That Role

by David Lefkowitz

(Note: this article was first published in October 2017)

When Gal Gadot was born in spring 1985, the American television series Wonder Woman had already been off the air for six years. By the time the Israeli actress hit the big screen in this summer’s Wonder Woman movie, the original TV program had already settled into media history as a nostalgic wedge of 1970s cheese: silly, campy, and can’t-look-away-colorful. Another reason eyes were glued to the small screen was its gorgeous star, Lynda Carter, five foot nine niches of glamour packed into a costume that accentuated her . . . well, everything.

That Carter, at 66, has effortlessly held onto her iconic glamour is of more interest to fans and new WW converts than to the lady herself, who was taught early on that good looks could be helpful but had better not be the only commodity you have to offer. In our mid-summer phone conversation, Carter, at work on her fourth studio album, talked freely about her music, her early years, her attitudes and addictions, and the responsibility of being the woman behind the bare shoulders and bracelets.

LONG ISLAND WOMAN: Your last two albums mixed American standards with more contemporary songs by people like James Taylor and The Eagles. Are you planning something similar with the next one?
LINDA CARTER: I guess some are standards, though it’s hard to call them that because they come from such a wide variety of music: country, jazz, old rock and roll, Motown. I have a hard time trying to box in what I do. For example, we’re working on everything from a Chris Isaak cover of “Baby Did a Bad Bad Thing” to a country song I wrote called “After All These Years.” Also, “You’ve Changed,” the Billie Holiday song; “Take Me to the River,” ZZ Ward’s “Put the Gun Down,” “Lonely Boy” by The Black Keys, a couple of Everly Brothers songs, Bruce Springsteen’s “I’m on Fire,” and a completely re-thought version of “Stop in the Name of Love.”

LIW: How do you go about selecting the songs?
LC: They’re largely what I have chosen over the previous years to go in my live show. Throughout the year, I’m listening to the radio or Spotify, or my husband and son are always playing music. Or one day “Stop in the Name of Love” just came into my head, and I looked at the lyrics online, and I thought, “This is a great, great lyric.” But the way the original was approached, you don’t even listen to the lyrics. So I slowed it way down. You probably won’t even know what the song is until you hear the chorus.

LIW: So you have to connect to the songs in order to put them over?
LC: Everything I do is pretty much a story. A song has to mean something to me—even if it just makes me laugh. I’ll usually have the guitar player do a quick reference demo just to write down the chord charts and how I want to approach it—be it a completely new arrangement or the song itself is obscure. I’m not usually picking a Top 10 record going down the Grammy list. It’s some indie band or something I really want to sing because I love it. For example, I really pared down Eric Clapton’s “If I Could Change the World.” It’s a love song but also a message song about how I really feel about the present condition of the world. If we could just change the world, just change it.

LIW: Well, your world changed after you won the Miss World USA title. Your family had been struggling beforehand.
LC: My mom and dad divorced when I was ten or eleven, and we were scraping by. I worked in one of my uncle’s restaurants and wasn’t really good at that. But I earned enough money to buy school clothes and help my mom. I also worked weekends at a little office doing mimeographing for extra money. At 14, the summer before I went into high school, I joined a band, and that was great, because on a weekend, you could make $75—that was a fortune in 1965. At first, I couldn’t even drive myself to the venues. But at 15, if you had a learner’s permit in Arizona, you could drive, so I did.

When I look at it now, it’s absolutely ridiculous that I was that independent. But I just told my mom what I was doing, and she’d say, “Okay, that’s great.” My brother was off putting himself through college, and my sister was doing what she was doing, so my mom had her hands full. But I always got straight A’s, I never got in any trouble, I didn’t do drugs, and I didn’t date boys. Mom knew she could trust me and that I was a good girl.

LIW: Even though you were touring in a band?
LC: Eventually, I quit the road because I’d spent two and a half years with several different bands, and I knew at a young age I wasn’t going anywhere with that. The guys were men and a lot older than me. You’re living in these crappy motels, and you’re a road band, and you’re a girl singer going from one place to another, and no one’s gonna discover you. It was a dead end, and I knew that. So just quit and moved back to Arizona.

LIW: With no job prospects?
LC: (laughs) Thank God I never had to earn a real living at a real day job. I walked into a modeling agency in Scottsdale Arizona to see if I could get any modeling work, and they were putting on the Phoenix portion of the Miss Arizona pageant. My mom and my sister said, “You gotta do it! You’ll be too old if you don’t do it now.” And I did. I won Miss Phoenix, Miss Arizona, and Miss World USA in about a three-week period of time. It was really quick.

LIW: But not the game-changer you’d hoped it would be?
LC: There was no talent in this contest. It was a bogus kind of thing that wasn’t about anything, and not something I ever aspired to. You feel like a piece of meat as they’re parading you around with a crown and a banner. You’ve got a lot of people around you, and a lot of attention, but you’re opening grocery stores and cutting little ribbons in little towns. There’s no substance. They make you have a chaperone, and you’re not making any money. Whatever they’re charging these people, they’re ripping you off. If they’re making $100, they’re giving you $30 and keeping the rest of it. I mean, yes, it was a little exciting, but I wanted to move to L.A. and study acting and move on with my career.

LIW: At which point you got the role of a lifetime. Once Wonder Woman took off, did you have a level of creative control over Diana Prince?
Yes and no. I think you are restricted by what the words are on a paper. However, I fought tooth and nail for my own interpretation of how she needed to be. Thank goodness the director of the pilot episode was really in sync with me about Diana’s level of discovery in the new world. How she was very naïve and had a great sense of wonder and a fish-out-of-water feeling. Also, her goodness and sweetness. She wasn’t a jaded person; she was a feminist. It was important to me that her loving nature, as well as her fierceness defending what she believed in, was conveyed. I think I was able to do that.

LIW: Well, scheduling problems kept you from having a role in the new Wonder Woman movie. But you did see it, and . . . ?
LC: The director, Patty Jenkins, and I talked very early on, and I think she really understood who that character is. She gave these characters a sense of humor, depth, and inner life. She took the cartoon out of the character, you know? The truth is that every character off of a page is a cartoon. If I sometimes get blowback that Wonder Woman isn’t real, well, no character is real! Most of the politicians you see aren’t real. People you see in magazines—they’re not real; they’re all doctored up. Models aren’t that perfect; it’s an impossible standard to live up to. When you see people on the red carpet, you’re not seeing them in real life. It’s like Cary Grant’s famous line: “I’d like to be Cary Grant, too.”

LIW: But that’s the paradox. Beautiful people get opportunities plain people don’t, but then they complain that they’re judged mainly on their looks. Did you always find your reflection in the mirror a blessing and a curse?
LC: Hey, I appreciated it. Nobody ever feels sorry for you because you’re pretty (laughs). But we’ve all met people who take themselves too seriously because they’re rich or pretty. They’re boring, dull people who are not fun to be around. What helped me was having a very close relationship with my mother. I went through some teenage awkward years, and then I started singing and had a lot of people telling me that I was very pretty. But in my family, I have to say, I was unimpressed by that. My mother was very, very beautiful, and my father was very, very handsome. My brother’s very handsome, and my sister’s very pretty. But the emphasis in my family was about ethics, accomplishment, beauty being skin deep, exercise, education, good grades. So beauty was never something I put a lot of stock or effort into it. My thing was trying to be a creative, smart person, and to be about something.

LIW: You did have your burdens, though. Which led to an alcohol problem.
LC: I didn’t even drink until my mid-20s. My mother and father didn’t drink, but it is a genetic pre-disposition that existed on my mother’s side. So even though my mother did not have it, I got the gene. In the 80s, when I started using alcohol to avoid dealing with a bad marriage, and to escape and avoid dealing with my emotions, is when I got myself in trouble. You find it in the military and a lot of places, but alcohol is so insidious. It’s like opioid addiction running amok in the heartland now, while they’re cutting medical insurance for addiction. For years, Big Pharma made a ton of money off it, but no one’s talking about that part . . .

Anyway, as far as my own alcoholism, it took awhile. I would drink, and then I wouldn’t, and then I would. It was a slow process. But when I finally decided I really needed help, I went to rehab. Now I’m coming up on 20 years sober. I haven’t been to meetings in a long while, but I am very involved in recovery. I’m on the board of Ashley Treatment, which is a recovery center in Maryland, and it’s a very important aspect of my life. I am extremely careful about being mindful.

LIW: Speaking of mindfulness, I imagine most of our readers want to hear that you must spend twelve hours a day in the gym with trainers to keep looking the way you do.
LC: No, I just try to do a little something every day: pushups, walking, biking on the river. I try to be active watch what I eat. Just quantity, really. If I’m gaining a little—like, I think I’m probably a little bit over now—I’ll start to keep an eye on what I’m eating and go down a bit, and not let it get out of hand. Some people can just eat whatever they want…I’m not one of `em. I keep on keepin’ on, but mainly for health reasons.

LIW: Which also leads to the inevitable whispered question, “How much work do you think she’s had done?”
LC: It’s really funny. I’ll do Botox or Restylane, occasionally, if I’m gonna be doing a big photo shoot or something. I try to get rid of that middle frown line because it makes me look mad. But I don’t want to have a frozen face. I don’t want big lips. I am what I am. I’m not saying I’d never have plastic surgery, but I don’t think I will. I just don’t see myself having any cutting on my face because everyone that I’ve seen cut, they look entirely different. I’m kinda terrified. I know people who can afford the best surgeons in the entire world and still…I dunnoooooo. (laughs) Besides, my mom didn’t have any wrinkles when she died, and she was almost 90!

LIW: So much of who you are does seem to keep circling back to your mom.
LC: My mother was a remarkable woman. Even for the music I do . . . She used to play these juke-joint records. She had a collection of these old, scratchy 78s all about pain and suffering (laughs). “You done me wrong.” Sassy blues records from the South with these amazing singers. She also loved country music and rhumbas and things like Billie Holiday, Ella Fitzgerald, Harry Belafonte, Judy Garland, and torch singers. So that is what’s inside my bones and what I lean toward in my musical taste.

LIW: You mentioned before we started that some of the information about you on the web is wrong. Such as?
LC: There’s no “Córdova” in my name. I don’t know how that ever got started. It’s my mother’s maiden name, but it’s not on my birth certificate. And I did not go to Arizona State University. I got a scholarship that I turned down to go on the road. I did change “Lynda” from an “i” to a “y” before going into high school. There were a lot of people named Linda with an “i,” so I wanted to change it.

LIW: What about nearly having a featured role in Apocalypse Now?
LC: That’s true. I was in the jungle for three weeks, and we got typhooned out. They shut down for a couple of months, and by the time they were ready, I was doing Wonder Woman, so they had to replace me. But I was there with Charlie Sheen, Laurence Fishburne, and Frances Ford Coppola, and I’ve got a great picture at home of all of us to prove it!

LIW: Considering the film’s iconic status, was that a big career regret?
LC: No, it was an amazing experience being there with all of them. It didn’t work out, but I don’t regret it. You just move on.

*

SIDEBAR:
A LYTTLE MORE LYNDA

Favorite Songs of Your Own?
The song I wrote for my son, “Jamie’s Song (You’ll Change Just a Little),” and one I wrote for my husband, “After All These Years.”

Favorite Vacation Spot?
Maybe on a boat in the ocean, but really it’s anywhere my family is.

Favorite Website?
The Library of Congress: loc.gov. You can look up anything. It even has Thomas Jefferson’s first draft of the Declaration of Independence.

Favorite Episode of Wonder Woman?
The pilot. It was that new experience, that wondrous, amazing feeling that dreams come true.

What Have You Been Reading?
One of my favorite books was The Human Genome [by John Quackenbush]. Also, Jon Krakauer’s book about the Mormons, Under the Banner of Heaven. I like anything David McCullough writes.

What Have You Been Watching?
Bloodline with Sissy Spacek, Earth 2, and, of course, everybody loves House of Cards. Mostly, I’m wild about any and all documentaries. I love Vice, from Bill Maher’s production company. The stuff they cover is just amazingly great. And Nanking, about the Japanese invasion of China. It’s shocking and unbelievable.

Besides Wonder Woman, Which Other Roles Have Made You Most Proud?
I don’t really watch myself, but it would have to be my TV specials.

*

BYLINE:
David Lefkowitz is an adjunct professor of English at the University of Northern Colorado. He also co-publishes Performing Arts Insider (TotalTheater.com) and hosts Dave’s Gone By (davesgoneby.com) on UNC Radio. His comedy, Blind Date, was recently staged in Chennai, India.

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NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY PROFILE: Psyched: Cheryl Hines on Acting, Reacting, and the Kennedy Blessing

PSYCHED: Cheryl Hines on Acting, Reacting, and the Kennedy Blessing

by David Lefkowitz

(This article was first published in Long Island Woman, Sept. 2017)

So you’re a talented, attractive young girl growing up in Florida with ambitions to move to California and be a professional actress. We can guess how that scenario plays out 98 percent of the time: part-time jobs, near misses, small parts, and giving up when it’s time to start a family or settle on a fallback career. Then there’s the one percent who make a decent living thanks to union benefits, commercials and voice overs, and the occasional widely seen role. That leaves a last one percent for the few who hit the big time of red carpets, fortune, and fame.

Sliver off a fraction of that last percent, and you have Cheryl Hines, who didn’t start racking up IMDB credits until her late twenties yet now is famous, not only for playing Cheryl David on Curb Your Enthusiasm, but for marrying into American royalty. In 2014, the tanned and toned 52-year-old, who knew she wanted to be a professional actress even before she spent her high school years submerged in theater, married Robert F. Kennedy, son of the late Senator Bobby Kennedy and nephew of America’s 35^th president, JFK.

Not bad for a woman whose first credit was Swamp Thing (not the movie, the TV series), and whose big break emerged from watching faux husband Larry David create impossible situations and then shovel himself in deeper. When we spoke by phone in early summer, Hines had recently wrapped the ninth season of Curb, as well as the movie sequel, A Bad Moms Christmas (due out Nov. 3). Not surprising for someone who is now ensconced in a political family, Hines answered most questions in a slow, measured cadence as if weighing every phrase. And yet, her laughter punctuated the responses, and the overall impression was of a woman who appreciates her good fortune while understanding that staying lucky takes just as much effort as struggling.

LI WOMAN: Did performing in high school theater bring you to the next level in terms of your acting ambitions?

CHERYL HINES: When I played a student in The Children’s Hour, I learned so much from that experience. Even though I was still in high school, I was working with some of the Florida State University students, and they were so good. Everybody was very professional, and the director was great. He made us show up in character—so I don’t even think he knew my name! But he taught us that you have to show up and know your lines, and come in character, and know how your character looks and walks and talks and reacts to different things, and think about your character when you’re not onstage. It was a great experience for me.

 

And yet, almost conversely to all that preparation, you ended up as a member of the Groundlings improvisation and sketch troupe.

Sure, but the fundamental idea of improv is listening to your scene partner. Because there’s no script, all you can do is listen and respond. That idea carries through in any type of acting because it’s really about you, as a character, comprehending what the other person just said and reacting to it. I think a lot of acting classes stress the text and writing of a scene, which is understandable and important. As an actor, you really have to multi-task: your lines, your blocking, where you’re gonna stand or sit, how you’re gonna use props. But you shouldn’t lose the spontaneity of a moment that could be created. If you’re thinking too much about your next line, are you really listening to what that other person is saying?

 

That approach must have been helpful when you auditioned for Curb. I assume you didn’t get “sides.”

CH: Right, there was no script; it was all improvisation. I had never met Larry or Jeff Garlin or any of the gang before that moment. So that was an experience, and I was auditioning for an HBO project, which was exciting. But at the time, it was only a one-hour special, so I didn’t think it would change my life. I thought it would be great to get that job, but it didn’t feel like testing for a network TV show. So I felt relaxed about it. I just started improvising with Larry, and we really clicked.

 

Did he give you any cues about your character?

I was told that Cheryl has heard it all from him and that she doesn’t take any of his shit! That was all I got. It was just one audition, and my agent called me later that day and told me I got the job. Which never happens in this business!

 

Speaking of jobs, your pre-success labors included waitressing and being a phone operator, but also an enviable personal-assistant gig.

Yes, for Rob Reiner and his wife, Michele. And I had a really good time doing that. It was still stressful, don’t get me wrong (laughs). But they were very supportive of my career. At the time, I was still going through the Groundlings school, and [the Reiners] would come to all of my shows. So I had a really great relationship with them. Even though I was doing seemingly mindless errands—like picking up dry cleaning—they understood that I was working to become an actress. And that meant a lot to me.

 

Rob Reiner has produced and directed his share of movies and TV shows. How did you stop yourself from saying, “Um, can you throw me a bone, please?”

(laughs) The temptation is great. But I also knew when I took the job that that was not going to be part of the dynamic. Everyone in Los Angeles is an actor or writer, so in order to have a job where you’re working with somebody who is already established in the business, you must understand the boundaries, or you’ll always be frustrated. With any job, if you do it with integrity, the people around you will see who you are and what your character is made of.

These days, I’m friends with Rob and Michele, and we go out to dinner. We’ve become more like peers.

 

And if you hadn’t made it as an actress, you might have been . . .?

A psychologist. I really am interested in people and how they think and adjust to the complications of life.

 

You’ve mentioned in previous interviews that a psychology course you took in high school really affected you—especially in terms of ruminating on human mortality.

Part of the course was a death-and-dying seminar. It struck me then that death is so much a normal part of our existence and our journey, but for some reason, our society doesn’t seem to be open about it. I thought that was very interesting. It sounds dramatic to say but, of course, we are all gonna die. Yet it always seems shocking when someone we know passes. I thought, at the time, maybe there’s a better way for us to approach all this—but it was never in a goth kind of way or “life is so hard and I’m a tortured soul.” It’s more that this is part of life and everyone’s journey, so why don’t we explore it?

 

Did that attitude help your grieving process when your father died a few years ago?

I think it did. I tried to focus on the gift that I got to experience with my father in his life and the idea that I was fortunate to have him for fifty years. This was instead of focusing on him not being here anymore. Now, it’s certainly easier to say that than to make yourself feel that way—but I do try to think of life and death that way. We are lucky to have each other, and we don’t know how long we’re gonna have them in our life, so be grateful that they were here and sad because you lose them.

 

Well, after that loss and the divorce from your ex, producer Paul Young, you certainly gained a family—including a husband and six stepchildren to go with your own daughter. What does it mean to be a Kennedy?

Ummm . . . being a Kennedy is . . . (laughs) It’s normal and it’s extraordinary at the same time. It’s normal in that I married a great guy who has an amazing family and, at the same time, everybody has their struggles. (long pause)

 

I guess you have to weigh your words carefully.

I do, I really do! When it comes to the Kennedys, sometimes it’s all larger than life. A lot of people know who they are.

 

Aren’t you used to recognition yourself?

It was probably easier for me to adjust to being in the spotlight than someone who had never been recognized out in public before. Still, in a normal week, I’m playing Trivial Pursuit with my family, and the answer is: my husband’s uncle. So that gets weird! Every week there is something surreal.

 

So despite the obvious, what made Robert F. Kennedy Jr. the man you wanted to marry?

Bobby is one of the smartest, most intelligent people I’ve ever met. He’s funny—although I don’t think his public persona shows that because he talks about serious subjects a lot. I don’t know. It’s hard to talk about why you fall in love with someone. I have a good time with him, and he inspires me to be a better person. I always joke that my biggest fear is that we’ll be traveling in a Third World country, my appendix will burst, and he will remove it—because he’s very good at survival-type skills.

 

So did you learn anything about real marriage from your David marriage?

That’s a good question! I think the big idea of marriage is to pick and choose your battles. So, yes, I probably have learned to be more tolerant in my real marriage from being married to Larry David on screen. (giggles)

 

Do you foresee any of the kids going into politics?

I wouldn’t rule it out. It’s difficult to know now how they’re all going to shape into adults and what their aspirations may be. But they’re all very intelligent, and, certainly, politics is a part of their lifestyle. Almost all of our kids have volunteered in humanitarian ways, and they’re aware of civil justice and the fight for it. I think most kids aren’t really exposed to that sort of thing when they’re 13, 15, 18, so that gives ours a different awareness of the inner workings of policies maybe. Probably. But will they be passionate about it as adults? I don’t know.

 

Do you see your celebrity and family status as a platform to espouse your own political views? That’s a pretty formidable soapbox.

I’m definitely more aware of how my political views might be interpreted because I, personally, am in the public eye. Most of the time, though, I really don’t want to mix my political feelings with my acting career. They’re separate for me.

 

Okay, but say something you believed in was being threatened under the current administration. For example, Planned Parenthood?

I am pro-Planned Parenthood. And I would feel inspired to fight just as a citizen, as a mom, as a person who gets to vote in the United States. Yes, it’s an advantage if more people pay attention because I have a different platform. But at the same time, I understand that everyone has the choice to listen to the person they want to listen to and make their own decision.

 

Speaking of politics, this morning, President Trump inflamed women—and everyone, really—with his mockery of MSNBC personality Mika Brzezinski for having a facelift. For actresses, plastic surgery can be an especially fraught topic. As someone who works out three times a week and is also active in yoga and outdoor activities, where do you stand on nipping and tucking?

I’m not here to judge what someone does to make herself feel or look better. I know people who say, “Don’t do it! I would never do it!” And those people are 25! Meanwhile, the Kardashians have changed the world of plastic surgery to where they’ve made it almost chic. That’s strange, and I don’t know how much I like that trend. But I don’t care. I’m not gonna worry about it. People should do whatever they want.

 

No question, Curb is your best-known credit, alongside the sweet movie Waitress, and three seasons of the network sitcom Suburgatory. Is there a project you’re proud of that hasn’t gotten similar attention but you wish viewers would seek out?

There’s a quirky film called Bart Got a Room. William H. Macy plays my ex-husband in it, and it’s such an interesting, funny movie. We look ridiculous in it but we’re playing versions of real people.

 

Speaking of interesting and funny, you also got to work with the late Robin Williams on the 2006 comedy, RV. Any memories?

Robin was a very intelligent, creative, magnetic soul. And he really appreciated people. When he’d walk down the street and somebody would come up to him, he would act like that was the first time anybody had asked him for his autograph. He was kind to them because he knew that it was important to them at that moment. That’s who Robin was. He appreciated people and was just a very generous soul.

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HINES IN A FEW LINES

Recent books you’ve read?

This circles back to death and dying again, but Where the Dead Pause, and the Japanese Say Goodbye: A Journey (Marie Mutsuki Mockett). Also, I just started re-reading Nick Hornby’s How to be Good. It’s one of my favorite books.

What’s on your iPod?

I listen to a lot of hip-hop—just to work out to, and my daughter likes it. I like Beyoncé—who doesn’t? Also, Chance the Rapper because it’s my daughter’s type of music, and we do a lot together.

Favorite vacation spot?

I really liked the Turks and Caicos when I went there. The water was so beautiful, warm, and clear. I’d like to go back there.

Favorite actor?

Mary Tyler Moore really influenced me. She was always so funny and authentic. That really inspired me to want to be like her.

TV shows you watch for fun?
Ray Donovan, Veep, and, well, I don’t like to talk about it openly, but I really love Dancing with the Stars. My daughter laughs at me because I cry at every episode because they’re trying so hard.

Would you ever be on it?

That’s a good question. It certainly sounds fun to me. But my acting career might get in the way.

Favorite Meal?

On the perfect night, I would have a California roll and a spicy edamame. Not exciting, but it’s the truth. I’m on the verge of being a vegetarian, but I still like bacon. So if I’m having a salad, I like bacon bits. I don’t know what that says about me, my dedication, or my personality, but I’m sure it’s not good!

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BYLINE:

David Lefkowitz is an adjunct professor of English at the University of Northern Colorado. He also co-publishes Performing Arts Insider (TotalTheater.com) and hosts Dave’s Gone By (davesgoneby.com) on UNC Radio. To read bunches of his plays, articles, and songs, visit https://davelefkowitzwriting.wordpress.com/

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NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY PROFILE: Rebounder: Mackenzie Phillips on Wellness, Loss, and Love

Rebounder: Mackenzie Phillips on Wellness, Loss, and Love

(This article was first published in Long Island Woman magazine, Aug. 2017)

by David Lefkowitz

It’s hard to find a more cautionary tale about the evils of drugs and alcohol than the life of Mackenzie Phillips—a movie actress at 13, a TV star by 15, and a death-spiraling junkie for years after that. Add to that an alcoholic mother and a genius dad who squandered his wealth and talent, and you’ve got a recipe for a tragic waste of life.

Except that’s not the end of the story, of course. After her troubled years on One Day at a Time and seemingly innocuous stretch as a singer backing up her father, John Phillips, in the re-formed Mamas and the Papas, Mackenzie finally got clean and sober. Sporadic TV work followed, including three seasons of the Disney show, So Weird, and guest spots on Norman Lear’s current reboot of One Day. More importantly, the woman who spent so many years staring down drugs, alcohol, incest, and overdoses, now has a shocking day job: she’s a primary counselor at Breathe Life Healing Centers, a treatment facility for addicts seeking rehabilitation and recovery. Oh, and just to make us boomers feel ancient, she’s a 57-year-old mom of a 30-year-old musician.

In our phone chat following the publication of her second memoir, Hopeful Healing: Essays on Managing Recovery and Surviving Addiction, Phillips is direct, even blunt, but also prone to punctuate funny or ironic thoughts with a throaty laugh. Troubled TV teen Julie Cooper may seem like Mary Poppins compared to the actress who played her, but Mackenzie the survivor has earned the right to leaven grim reality with pragmatism and hope.

I guess the best possible question to start with is: how are you?

I have never been better. My life is very full and very beautiful. It’s full of purpose and service to others. Things are just amazingly good for me.

Which means that you’ve been sober for how long?

I find it so interesting that people equate length of sobriety with wellness. What I’ve found is that time doesn’t necessarily treat or heal this thing. I’ve been sober a long time. But I know people who’ve been sober a long time who aren’t well; they’re just sober.

Meaning?

They’re just not drinking. But there’s a journey, and it’s from sobriety to recovery. Being physically abstinent—there’s nothing wrong with that. I think it’s beautiful, and I applaud it. But there’s a deeper experience to be had. It’s what you do on the day you’ve been given and not how long you’ve been doing it that I focus on. Especially working with my clients here where I’m sitting in my office. (laughs)

Do you remember the moment in your life when you went from sober to well?

I don’t think you can point out a certain day. It’s a gradual process. And then one day you just go, “Wow, I feel pretty good!” It’s not an epiphany moment. It’s more of a slow awareness that things are shifting and changing.

It’s one thing to heal yourself; it’s another to get a counseling certification and attain professional status. When did you feel truly qualified to do what you’re doing now?

There’s feeling you’re qualified, and then there’s, “Wait, you have to go to school!” I’ve always felt I’ve had some sort of ability to reach people, but there’s a confidence that comes from having the education to back it up. So when you walk into your office, close the door, and sit with your client, you know what you’re doing. Or I hope you know what you’re doing! (laughs)

So the training specifically helps with…?

Well, what pops into mind is that as a counselor, I get to sit and identify with people and help them through their recovery. That’s about 30 percent of it. There’s a great deal of documentation and paperwork and electronic medical-records charting that’s involved. You don’t really consider that when you’re romanticizing the idea of being a counselor. It was challenging at first but not anymore. I love it.

Although your first book, High on Arrival, dealt with the autobiographical details of your addiction years, Hopeful Healing is both about your recovery process and coping with the slow deterioration of your mom, who died during the writing. Was her dementia caused by, or at least exacerbated by, her alcoholism?

My mother was sober 18 years when she passed away. I’m not a doctor; I really don’t know.

The day she passed…what went through your mind?

It was difficult. I was sad, but there was also a sense of “it’s time.” Things happen in God’s time and not mine. Her world had gotten very, very small. She still knew who I was; it’s not like she was in a deep, deep state of dementia. Just a couple of weeks before she passed away, she turned 80. My son Shane and I took her to brunch. She had her favorite: eggs benedict. It was really beautiful, and I gave her a little diamond peace sign which I’m wearing around my neck right now. I thought a lot about what a great mom she was, and how she was Bob McNamara’s personal secretary at the Pentagon, and she was a single mother when it wasn’t cool being a single mother, and how much I loved her and how grateful I was for her, how we had so many years being sober sisters together. I just felt full of love and sadness and appreciation and devastation. All at the same time.

People who have to care for others in that state often do it out of love, but duty and guilt invariably get mixed into those feelings. Was your experience like that?

The book has a whole chapter that talks about the difference between guilt and obligation. How hard it is when you have a parent who’s failing and slipping into their own little world. It becomes, “Oh my God, I have to go. I don’t wanna go, but I have to go. I want my mommy. But I’m now my mommy’s mommy.” So a lot of people feel shame and guilt around that stuff, but it’s just normal.

My mom was just the most adorable little old lady you could possibly imagine, but there were moments when she was very mean. That is also something that happens with dementia: the turn. One moment, she’s loving, and the next she’s furious because the TV remote isn’t working.

Heck I’m like that. But seriously, in the difficult moments, do you draw on the happier ones?

I draw on my love for my mother.

Having seen your mom through this illness, did that spur you on to prepare your son for a just-in-case scenario down the road? Have you laid out your proverbial “Five Wishes?”

I don’t have any of those things in place, although I probably should. My mom went into assisted living ten years ago. She had very-difficult-to-control diabetes, COPD, and early dementia. She just couldn’t take care of herself. And I said to Shane, “Dude, you’re just gonna have to put me in a home.” And he said, “I will never put you in a home.” I said, “But I’m not your responsibility.” He’s just so loving and kind, so bright and level-headed. And he’s like, “Nope. You’re staying home with me forever.” I said, “That might change, son. God knows with the twists and turns of fate what can happen.”

But with mom, more than anything, I didn’t think about myself. After my mom passed away, I thought about all of the things, the actual material things that you can hold in your hand. The things my brother Jeffrey and I had to sort through. It made me realize that when I die, I don’t want Shane to have to be like, “Oh God, this drawer is full of stuff.” You know, the boxes. That was the hardest thing. She had 18 pairs of broken reading glasses and one pair that worked, you know? (laughs) It made me think, “What am I leaving for Shane to clean up?”

Do you think you’ll get empty-nest syndrome when he’s ready to leave home?

He’s already left once, and then he came back. The world is different now than it was when I was younger. A lot of 25-30-somethings are living at home. When he decides to individuate and do his thing, I’d probably sell the house—`cause I don’t need the big, giant house for just me. But I had empty nest once, and I managed to survive it, so I imagine I could survive it again.

One other thing you had to survive was a surprising backlash over the revelations in your first book. Foremost was the recollection of passing out, waking up in a hotel-room bed, and finding your father on top of you, raping you. An on/off sexual relationship ensued for a decade, during which he paid for you to abort what he assumed was his baby. Rather than sympathy, members of your family who read this actually gave you grief.

I didn’t expect the backlash, and I was very naïve about that. But I also didn’t expect the support—the army of women and men who are survivors of sexual abuse who have come forward. I don’t regret it at all. I mean, maybe in a personal way I do, but in a more altruistic way, for the greater good, I opened up a national dialogue about something not generally spoken about. So for that, I’m very grateful.

As for my family, that was a very tough six or seven years there for me. And, I’m sure, for them. But we are reunited, and it feels so good! I’m in a very loving family situation with my siblings, and it’s really nice.

In retrospect, how do you feel about your father?

Gosh. There’s no one word. I could not give you one word.

Rancor? Disgust?

It’s a heavy thing, but if I was still carrying that anger and fury and devastation around with me today, how could I possibly be well and happy and grounded? I see what happened. It helps me understand the power of drugs and alcohol and the power of untreated mental illness. It makes me understand that he was troubled, a tortured man, and I have compassion for that. That doesn’t mean I give him a full pass for what he did. Absolutely not. But I’m at peace with my forgiving him before he died. I’m at peace with revealing everything so openly. I’m at peace with the fact that my sisters and some people in my life couldn’t be in a relationship with me for a long time. And I’m at peace with the fact that that’s not happening anymore and that we’re all together again.

Speaking of parents, you had surrogate ones, of a sort, for a few years when you were on One Day at a Time. Alas, both Bonnie Franklin and Pat Harrington have now passed. Any thoughts or recollections?

Bonnie was one of the funniest, raunchiest women. She had a great sense of humor and a potty mouth, which I completely identify with. She was so loving to me even when I didn’t understand, like back in the early days on the show. She was setting boundaries with me—and I didn’t know what that felt like. Which I can, in retrospect, really appreciate. And I was able to thank her and love her. For many, many years after One Day at a Time was over, we remained close. So the day that I got the email saying she’d been diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, I just could not believe what I was reading. She mothered me in a very specific kind of way, and she was like a second mom to me. I loved her tremendously.

And Pat Harrington?

Oh my God, I loved that guy. He was so funny. I learned so much from him about timing, what’s funny and what isn’t funny. A wonderful man. A great dad—he had all these beautiful children. Just a good guy.

I interviewed Valerie Bertinelli a couple of months ago for Long Island Woman. She admitted that she experimented with drugs during the Van Halen years but was too much of a control freak to do more than dabble. Considering the turmoil you caused on the set back then, I assume you and she must have had friction. Ancient history?

It’s a good relationship, and we get along great. It wasn’t always that way. I didn’t blame her for anything, and I don’t know if she blamed me or not. I just loved her from afar until she was ready to be in a relationship with me again. When she was, we have been close ever since. There’s an open and loving line of communication between us. She has her cooking show, which I’ve guested on almost every season that it’s been on the air. Her husband Tom and I are friends, too.

Val and I are only six months apart in age, so there’s a time of the year when we’re both the same age. When April 23^rd comes around every year, I know she’s caught up with me at least for the next six months. I always text her, and we laugh about it.

Last question: For so many years, you lived as an addicted person. Does that stay with you, and you just channel your addictions into healthier pursuits?

I don’t have to be addicted to anything. I’m not addicted to anything. (laughs) Here’s the deal. What I want people to understand is that addiction is a brain disorder; it’s not a moral failing. I think people get that really mixed up. Am I addicted to anything? No. I’m very low-key. I’m very easygoing, though I might get a little anxious here and there. But I love my job, I love my work, I love to write. It’s all very balanced, I guess.

*

MACK SNACKS

What books have you been reading?

The Woman in Cabin 10 by Ruth Ware — a mystery-whodunnit kind of thing, which I really enjoyed. Then a novel by Kevin Kwan called Crazy Rich Asians. It’s hilarious.

Songs on your playlist?

I really like a song called I am Light by India Arie. And the good old Rolling Stones. Exile on Main Street is one of my favorite albums of all time, so I listen to that a lot.

Did you really have sex with Mick Jagger while your father was fixing you both tuna fish sandwiches?

That’s completely true. It is a dubious distinction having slept with Mick Jagger because I was one of many. Still, it gave me a great story.

Tuna aside, your favorite meal?

I like Mexican food. Veggie tacos. Also, my son and I like to make a vegetarian shepherd’s pie. Morningstar Farms makes a meat substitute that crumbles like ground beef.

Do you have a favorite vacation spot?

I love a place in Desert Hot Springs California called Two Bunch Palms, where I’ve been going since I was fourteen. It’s rich with California history and has underground mineral hot springs that come up. Just a beautiful, beautiful place.

How do you unwind from work?

I love my dogs. I have four rescues: two pugs and two Chihuahuas. I love to read. I love to swim. That’s the kind of stuff that I do.

Have you been dating?

No. I’m in a fantastic relationship with myself. I think I found “the one!” (hearty laugh)

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BYLINE:

David Lefkowitz is an adjunct professor of English at the University of Northern Colorado. He also co-publishes Performing Arts Insider (TotalTheater.com) and hosts Dave’s Gone By (davesgoneby.com) on UNC Radio. His comedy, Blind Date, was recently staged in Chennai, India.

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NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY PROFILE: To the Oval Office from the Bunion Derby: Allison Janney’s Slow Rise to Stardom

To the Oval Office from the Bunion Derby: Allison Janney’s Slow Rise to Stardom

by David Lefkowitz

(Note: This article was first published in Long Island Woman, April 2017)

 

When a woman stands six foot tall in flats, being noticed isn’t an issue.  Or at least, that would be the assumption.  However, it took Allison Janney more than a decade of underpaid toiling on New York’s Theater Row and taking television roles like Party Guest, Saleslady, Podiatric Nurse, and Gum Puller before the movies and her signature “West Wing” redemption arrived.  Of course, once C. J. Cregg became a living-room fixture, Janney was no longer just the tallest woman in the room; she was now among the most lauded, awarded (seven Emmys, two Drama Desks, three Tony nominations), and remarkable, as well.

For struggling performers early in their careers, having supportive parents and mentors can be crucial to survive the rough patches.  Janney enjoyed both in spades, as she explains, “My mother, who had been an actress, always said I was an incredibly determined young girl no matter what I tried to do.  So I guess in the back of my mother’s mind, she thought, `It may take awhile, but she’ll get there.’  And though my father was concerned about my financial situation and suggested I might wanna think about a fallback, he never said, `You can’t do this anymore.’”

As for mentors, Janney met hers at Kenyon College in Ohio: Paul Newman and his wife, Joanne Woodward.  Newman, a class of `49 alum, directed the budding actress (class of `82) in her first play at the college.  “It was by Michael Cristofer, who won the Pulitzer Prize for The Shadow Box,” Janney recounts.  “It was called — get ready for it — CC Pyle and the Bunion Derby.  It was about a marathon race.  Anyway, I was struck with how much Paul loved actors and acting.  He told me after one performance that if I ever needed a favor, I could call on him for it: `It would have to be very specific — so think about it — but I’m there for you.’  For me, that was like having a valium in my back pocket.  For those moments when I wanted to quit, I thought, `Is this the thing to call Paul?’  But I never called him on the favor.  Just knowing it was there gave me a lot of confidence.”

Woodward, too, proved an important ally.  “Joanne directed me in so many plays,” Janney says.  “She just encouraged us all to trust ourselves and remember a sense of `play.’   She was one of the loveliest of women.  And she provided us young actors with a place to read plays and showcase our talents at a time when we couldn’t get cast in anything because we didn’t have Equity cards.  But you can’t get your Equity card unless you’re in something.  It was this unbelievable Catch 22.  Joanne gave us a place where we could put on productions and invite agents and casting people to come see us.  She gave us a leg up, which certainly helped me stay in longer than I might have.”

That said, even with legendary stars putting the wind at her back, Janney had to call on her own determination to brave the stormy Hollywood seas.  She recounts her oft-told story about visiting the Johnson-O’Connor Research Foundation to take aptitude tests that would help her figure out if she was qualified to do anything else in the world besides act.  “I always came up short,” she admits.  “But it was one of those things where a job would come through right at the last minute — just before I was gonna buy a plane ticket to go home.  I guess I had a guardian angel with a sense of humor.”

The gods of theater must have been whimsical, too, since the first play Janney ever saw as a child wasn’t Peter Pan or Our Town, but Miss Margarida’s Way, a satire of authority gone mad as represented by a ranting and abusive schoolteacher.  “Yup, that play is the first one I remember,” Janney chuckles.  After that, she did do the requisite school stints in Fiddler (as Golde), A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum (as Domina) — “I was always playing men or older women because I was taller than everyone else” — and Oliver! (as Noah Claypole, the Undertaker’s Son).

Luckily, Janney’s pre-star years gave her more unusual and challenging assignments.  “One of my favorite things I ever did,” she recalls, “was a Nicky Silver play called Fat Men in Skirts at Naked Angels back in the day (1994).  It was really fun, and it co-starred Stanley Tucci, Marisa Tomei, and Matt McGrath.  I also did the movie Big Night (1996) with Stanley Tucci, and Drop Dead Gorgeous (1999), which is a hilarious mockumentary with a huge cult following.”

That same year became a turning point for Janney’s move from steadily working character actress to household name.  “I was out in Los Angeles filming American Beauty and Nurse Betty,” she notes, “and I got this call to audition for a pilot called The West Wing.  I wasn’t thinking of doing television, but my agent called me, and when I heard the show was by Aaron Sorkin and these other people, I was like, `Yeah, I’ve gotta go in for that.’”  Even after several auditions and callbacks, Janney was unsure about her status, since each time, she was asked few questions and given minimal direction or cues.  “Then I had to go in and test for the network,” she continues.  “I knew there were other women going up for the part and my chances of getting it were not great, so I just tried to look at it as research.  I told myself, ‘You’re gonna have to do this a lot [for TV], so it’s good to get this first one over with.’  But then a beautiful arrangement of flowers came to my room at the hotel I was staying in: `Welcome to the West Wing family, from Aaron Sorkin.’  I couldn’t believe it.  I jumped through a lot of hoops, but I ended up getting the part, and it changed my life.”

Janney’s life now involves a home in L.A., her dogs, her live-in boyfriend, and her co-starring role on a hit sitcom.  “I don’t have to audition a lot at this point in my career,” she says, “but I did for Mom because they wanted to make sure there was chemistry with Anna Faris and me.  I didn’t mind, since this is where auditioning can still be good.  It’s always nice, as an actor, to just get the offer.  But sometimes it’s good to audition and know that they know you can do it, and that they want you.”

The show’s sometimes dark subject matter — it follows a newly sober, single mom being helped and hindered by her mother, who is also a recovering addict — can hit close to home for Janney, since her brother battled similar demons and committed suicide in 2011.  The actress declines talking deeply about the tragedy but says about her role that, “depending on what the episode’s about…let’s just say I can access things in that world that are very real to me.  But it’s not a source of pain every day of my life.  I love doing a show that demonstrates to everyone there is recovery and hope and laughter.  That makes me feel really great — putting that out into the world.”

It’s the kind of positive energy Janney, who has described herself in previous interviews as unassertive and overly eager to please, derives from performing.  “When I’m acting,” she explains, “I definitely feel connected in a way that I don’t in many other areas in my life.  Somehow inhabiting another character and saying lines that have already been written out — there’s some sort of safety and freedom within the confines of the script and blocking that I find incredibly powerful.  I love it.

“Still, I always think I can do better,” Janney adds.  “I’m pretty hard on myself.  It might be a performance that I didn’t feel very emotionally connected to.  But when I’m connected, it feels right and comfortable and confident.  I don’t have to be judged for myself; I’m someone else.  It gives me freedom to be crazy and make big choices in ways that I’m a little more afraid to do in my real life.”

That might include fielding questions about her handsome boyfriend, Philip Joncas, a successful production manager who is (gasp!) 20 years younger than she is.  “We have a good sense of humor about our differences,” Janney asserts.  “There’s always room for a lot of laughter when I go, `Really?  You don’t know who so-and-so is?’  But it works.  We’ve been living together for about four years, we have a good time together, and we enjoy many of the same things.”

Marriage, however, will likely not be one of those things.  The 57-year-old actress, who had previously been in a two-decade relationship with actor Dennis Gagomiros, has long balked at the idea of turning relationships into legally binding contracts.  She notes, “If you don’t have kids, it’s not necessarily the greatest thing to do.  There’s a romantic notion behind marriage, but there’s also inviting the government into your life.  It’s just something I never felt the need to do and still don’t.”

Politics is another subject Janney approaches warily, even though she’s often expected to expound to because of her West Wing residency.  “Everyone assumed I was as smart as C.J. about politics,” Janney sighs, “which I’m certainly not.  I did something for Hillary; though, obviously, I didn’t win it for her there!  But I’ll tell you, after this election, I definitely have a responsibility to be more involved politically.  I’m not very comfortable speaking out about politics, but I will definitely lend my name and do whatever I can.”

Certainly, the toned and statuesque actress is doing what she can to maintain her energy and red-carpet glamour.  She goes for long walks with her three dogs and recently ordered a Peloton bike and added a gym — including rowing machine, weights and other exercise equipment — to her garage.  “My boyfriend is really great at leading me in a workout,” says Janney, “and I also have a Pilates instructor that I see.  I think it’s really important for me, as I get older, to stay in shape.  I find that it helps my mental health, too.  If I come home from a hard day at work and get in a hard workout, I always feel better afterwards.”

As for diet, the actress relies on sensible choices and moderation rather than any particular eating plan.  She laughs, “I try to stay away from our Craft Service table at Mom, which is always loaded with incredibly yummy things like macaroni and cheese and brownies.  I also try to eat small meals throughout the day — protein and vegetables mostly — every three-to-four hours, so portion control is a huge thing.  I can always have a piece of cake or a cookie, just as long as I balance it out with a workout or walking.    I’ve done that thing of, `No pasta!  No bread!  No carbs at all!’  It just becomes such a crazy way to live.  Why not just have a little of what you want and not go crazy?”

“Crazy” is also the word Janney uses to describe some of the choices she made when she was young and visiting the South Shore:  “I loved Long Island.  As a little girl, I used to go every summer to the Lawrence Beach Club.  It was a very happy place for me to come visit my grandparents in Cedarhurst.  Even now, I spend a lot of time out in Sag Harbor doing plays at the Bay Street Theater.  I have a dear friend who lives out there, too, and I visit her once a year.

“But my first boyfriend was from Levittown,” Janney adds.  “He was an actor, as well; we met at the Neighborhood Playhouse in New York City.  And we spent a lot of time out at his folks’ house.  He rode a motorcycle, and much to my mother’s chagrin, I would go out on the Long Island Expressway on the back of a motorcycle out to the Hamptons in the middle of the winter.  It was crazy!”  The actress laughs heartily, “Absolutely crazy.”

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ASKING ALLISON

What songs are you listening to these days?

“Sirens” by Monkey Safari, “Take California” by Propellerheads, and “She Came Along” by Sharam.  Also, from the Hamilton mixtape, Ashanti’s version of “Helpless” with Ja Rule.  It’s just beautiful.

What books have you read most recently?

Dave Eggers’s The Circle.  It’s a terrifying parable about where we could end up if we keep going the way we are with social media.  Also, Ann Lamott’s Bird by Bird.  Great book.

Do you have a favorite meal?

Cacio e pepe, which is just a fancy way of saying pasta with cheese and pepper.  Pasta with any kind of cheese and butter and salt and pepper: it’s my crack.

Your favorite vacation spot?

I like a staycation.  I have my dogs, and I don’t like to leave them when I go away.  So sometimes I just like to be with my boyfriend.  Just us and the dogs relaxing at home.

If you could go back and give advice to your 20-year-old self, what would it be?

Go to the gym!  (laughs) And learn to meditate.  I tried to learn forever and kept avoiding it.  Finally, I was like, “Oh my God.  I can’t believe I didn’t do this before!”

What’s your all-time favorite theater experience as an audience member?

Seeing Balm in Gilead that Steppenwolf did many years ago at [off-Broadway’s] Circle Rep.  I just remember being blown away by Laurie Metcalf and Glenne Headley.  Also A Doll’s House on Broadway with Janet McTeer.

Is there an acting part you really wanted that didn’t go your way?

Conveniently, I erase those terrible memories out of my head.  But I did audition for Roz in Frasier.  The role went to my dear friend, Peri Gilpin.  But later I got West Wing, so everything works out the way it’s supposed to.  I keep my eye on the future because another door will open somewhere else.

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BYLINE:

David Lefkowitz hosts Dave’s Gone By (davesgoneby.com) weekly on UNC Radio.  He’s also an adjunct professor of English at the University of Northern Colorado and co-publishes Performing Arts Insider theater journal (TotalTheater.com).  David’s Long Island Woman interview with Lily Tomlin won a 2016 Media Award from the Press Club of Long Island.  The Miracle of Long Johns, David’s play, won the best non-fiction script award at the 2015 United Solo Festival.

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NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY PROFILE: Valerie Bertinelli: Taking Life One Dish at a Time

Valerie Bertinelli: Taking Life One Dish at a Time

by David Lefkowitz

(Note: This article was first published in Long Island Woman, March 2017)

 

Rocco DiSpirito. Giada De Laurentiis. Rachael Ray. Valerie Bertinelli. One of these names may seem out of place in the annals of Italian cooking, but if you’ve been watching the Food Network the last year or so, you know that last name is as prominent as the first three.  Bertinelli, the spunky teen-turned-poster girl-turned-rock star’s wife-turned-veteran comedy actress is now well into her fifth season hosting Valerie’s Home Cooking, a celebration of comfort food with a Neapolitan bent.

The show’s theme and workable schedule make a fine fit for the Hot in Cleveland star, 57, who lives in the Hollywood Hills with her second husband, financial planner Tom Vitale.  Though a far cry from her tumultuous years with Eddie Van Halen, Bertinelli’s on good terms with her ex.  In fact, she has to be: their son, Wolfgang, has been touring with the Van Halen band since 2006 and is set to release his first solo record this year. Still, the ever-youthful actress, who attained instant stardom at age 15 when Norman Lear chose her to play Ann Romano’s good-girl daughter Barbara on One Day at a Time, is most content at home, enjoying her life, husband, creative pursuits, and, of course, cuisine.

Are you really five years in on Valerie’s Home Cooking already?  It seems like it just started.

Each season is 10-13 episodes, so they go quickly.  We’ve done four seasons in a little over a year.  Even in Hot in Cleveland, we did six seasons in four-and-a-half years.  TV is so different from when I first started!  In the summer, they’d show repeats, and then you’d come back on in September.  It doesn’t work that way anymore, and I’m still trying to get used to it! (laughs)

So how is your show different from other cooking shows?

They’re all a little different because they’re personality-driven.  For me, I’m bringing that Italian background: different things I’ve grown up with and the women who taught me how to cook.  Also, my relationship with my husband and us cooking together, and how we make a date night.  Plus the recipes that I’ve loved all through the years and recipes I come up with even today.  Things I think people would love because I love them.  It’s basically sharing my world with people who have known me for way too long to mention.

Did you become more Italian when you married again?

(laughs)  It certainly feels that way!  His love of cooking really inspired me, too.  He does an amazing chicken paillard — a pounded chicken with breadcrumbs.  And I’ll do the salad on top of it.  He’s really got grilling, cooking, and pounding chicken down to a science.  I still haven’t gotten that down, and I’ve been cooking longer than him!

So what’s your specialty?

My casseroles, my lasagna, my gumbo, my turkey chili, my meatloaf.  Comfort foods, basically.

Those all sound like dishes with 15 ingredients you can throw together because, no matter what, they’ll all balance out.

 (laughs)  Kinda.

I mean, even I can make a decent meatloaf.

You don’t make it as good as mine, I’m sure.

Whoa!  So what’s your secret ingredient then?

I actually add pancetta [cured pork] to my turkey meatloaf.  You get all the fun and the fat and the flavor from the pancetta.  But I like the taste of turkey more than beef.

I sometimes use ground lamb.

Oooh!  Some people don’t like the taste of lamb; I happen to disagree with them.  My lambchops are not to be beaten.  Sorry, I sound like I’m being braggadocious!

Well, you have a cooking show.  You should be making decent food . . .

I better, right?  I mean, growing up, I had my mom and my grandmother.  Then I came to find out that my great grandmother, Maria Mancha, was actually a cook in a summer home in Sanremo.  She had a gelato cart so that she could save her money and come to America.  Unfortunately, we never got to meet, but my grandmother, Maria’s daughter, taught me a lot of stuff.  And then my mother, who is English-Irish, cooked Italian like nobody’s business.  You’d think she was Italian.

Did you feel you had a normal childhood up till your middle teens?

I feel like I had a normal one after that, too.  I had a weird job that a lot of people saw me do.  But other than that, I had a really normal home life.  My parents didn’t treat my job any differently than they treated the boys’ football games and practices, or piano lessons and accordion lessons.  Everybody was equal in our home.

But during the day, were you being tutored rather than attending school with your peers?

The shooting season went only from August through February.  So we had a tutor on the set half the time, and I would go to school the other half.  I can’t remember completely; it was a very long time ago!

But you didn’t feel like a stranger disappearing and reappearing for months at a time?

It was definitely challenging.  But I did have the same girlfriends who went to the same school, and they lived in the neighborhood, so we’d hang out.  I had that consistency.  They were good buffers for people who might have thought, “Oh, she must think she’s all that because she’s on TV.”  Which was quite the opposite; I was an incredibly insecure young lady.  Still, it all felt normal to me.

Any regrets about not going to college?

My son Wolfie’s kind of doing the same thing I did.  He’s getting into the business right away and recording an album right now.  So you know what?  I believe in college.  Higher education is always beneficial.  And I still feel a little lacking even at this age because I didn’t have it.  But the great thing about education is that it never stops.  I read voraciously and love books.  I’m always learning how to pronounce words because I feel like I’m never pronouncing them correctly.  I’m always looking things up.  That’s the great thing about this day and age; you really can look up anything on a computer and learn how you like to learn.

But as a teen, did you still feel normal when you were thrown into the guitar-god vortex?

That’s always a hard question for me because I always felt like me, and I don’t know what life would have been like any differently from the life that I led.  Insecurity latches onto anybody.  It’s all about mind over matter and not buying into the negative voices in your head.  I’m still working on that at 57!  I don’t think that’s ever over.  But believing in yourself is really strong because no one else can believe in you until you do.  That’s what I keep trying to remember.

So how has co-parenting been with Eddie Van Halen?
Well, Wolfie’s 25, so we don’t co-parent.  Sometimes we’ll all go to dinner together, and Janie and Ed send us a Christmas card.  Unfortunately, I don’t send out Christmas cards.  I probably should.  But yeah, I mean, we live only a couple of miles apart.  We don’t make an effort to see each other, but we don’t make an effort to not see each other.  You know what I mean?  We usually get together for Wolfie’s birthday.

I admit to being shocked when I read that at the height of those crazy years, you did cocaine along with your husband, Eddie Van Halen.  Honestly, I figured your seeing firsthand what was happening to [One Day at a Time co-star] Mackenzie Phillips would’ve scared you straight.

It’s just the nature of human beings that they want to experiment.  Luckily, it wasn’t something that I wanted to continue on in my life.  But experimentation is part of it, and I think that’s why we have to be careful with our children and make sure they don’t have the crutch of leaning on drugs or alcohol or anything else that takes them away from reality.  But that’s just a fact of human nature, experimentation.

Did you ever become addicted?

No, I never had to have treatment.  It’s just not part of my personality.  I have this control issue; if I don’t feel I have control of a situation, it makes me uncomfortable, and I don’t do that anymore.  Drugs always made me feel like I had no control over me or myself or the situation.  I can’t tell you when, why, or how I stopped; it just didn’t feel good any longer.  And if it doesn’t feel good to me, I don’t wanna do it.

Is food kind of an addiction?

Oh absolutely.  The thing about food is that, unlike alcohol or drugs, you have to have food to survive.  So now it’s just finding a place for food where it nourishes my body, and I enjoy it.  And food is love for me; it’s been all through my family.  It’s just finding an even keel through that ocean.

Although you’re no longer their spokesperson, are you still a Jenny Craig member?

That’s been over for quite a few years.  Their food was very good, and they did help me very much with portion control and how much fruits and veggies to eat.  If you don’t have a lot of time, Jenny Craig is super-super good and nutritious.  But I enjoy cooking so much that I’m trying to incorporate the ideas myself.  For example, I’ll make the Jenny Craig breakfast sandwich on my own with the ingredients that I know go in it.  It takes a little more effort, but it tastes just as good.

Now, sometimes I will have a ribeye for dinner.  Not very often.  And then I’ll have just a big kale salad.  It just depends on listening to your body and the vitamins your body knows it needs, because once you start denying yourself things, that’s what you start to crave.  It’s the old saying: don’t think about the elephant in the room because then that’s all you think about.  So I don’t want to ever deny myself anything, but also, nothing is ever as good as that first bite.  So I’ve tried to teach myself to stop chasing that first bite.

And for you, the cooking is as important as the eating?

I just really like making my own.  It’s therapy for me.  It’s art for me.  I come from a family of artists.  My mother’s a painter, my brother’s a web designer, my other brother’s a photographer, and my other brother’s a carpenter.  We have a very artistic bone in our family.  I love to sketch and paint and do needlepoint, but my art is through my food.

But then does exercise come into play to balance the lifestyle?

Living in California, I’m super lucky because I have a dog, Luna, who has to go out and walk.  We live in the Hills, so it’s literally 1.2 miles all around our block.  And we have this beautiful Runyon Canyon and Fryman Canyon, so I can go hiking in their trails.  Also, I have an elliptical at home that I really love.  So I’ll get on that if it’s raining.

I’m trying to really be good, so when I get off the elliptical or get back from a hike, I’ll do a 15-minute stretch — my legs, especially, because I’ve noticed that the older I get, the body doesn’t move as freely as it used to.  My Achilles tendons get tight, so I really have to stretch those.  I then meditate for a few minutes after, and I just calm myself back down again.  It really does help.  And every so often, I’ll take a soul cycle class because they’re fun.  I like working out with other people in a group.

So you don’t mind being recognized as a celebrity?

I’ve lived in this neighborhood for 14 years, so people here know me only as their neighbor.  Not a lot of my friends are celebrities.  And again, it goes back to this being the only life I’ve led.

As an actress, are you comfortable watching your work from years ago, or do you get self-conscious?

It can be hard, because we change and grow and become so many people during our lifetime.  So we try to appreciate it for what it was rather than going, “Oh, why did I do that?”  Instead it’s, “Oh, well.  It’s just part of me.”

I can watch Hot in Cleveland and just hysterically crack up because I don’t even feel like I’m watching myself.  I’m just watching four funny women.  And when I watch my cooking show, it’s like, “Oh yeah, wow!  I guess I do know how to do that!” (laughs)

How did you meet Tom Vitale?

He was friends with my brother in Arizona.  We had gone to a wine dinner together, and we just got along famously.  It was `04, when the Red Sox were winning the World Series.  We kept leaving the table separately to go watch the game, and once we got up together, and he said, “Are you going to see the game, too?”  “Yeah!”  We kept getting up out of the ballroom to go to the bar next door and watch the game.

Had you ever thought you’d get married again after all you’d been through?

No.  Not at all!  I wasn’t even dating.  I figured I’d be alone and have 40 cats.  Now I have a dog and five cats and a husband!  The pets are all shelter animals that I was fostering and I couldn’t find homes for — well, I didn’t try very hard.  I found homes for about 15 cats, and four of them, I kept, on top of my 16-year-old, who has been around forever.

Speaking of aging, so many of your peers have gone the plastic surgery route.  Assuming your baby face ever changes, would you go there?

I’m never gonna say “no,” but look, I broke my foot.  And I was gonna have an operation for it, and it was so freakin’ scary to me.  So to have someone cut into my face. . .  More power to the people who can do it, but it makes me nervous.

Even small stuff like Botox?

Maybe I will.  I dunno.  I’m never gonna say never.

Since you’ve had two hit shows, viewers are naturally curious about your former co-stars.  Any thoughts or anecdotes about, say, Betty White?

Are you kidding me?  I love that woman!  I would move into her house in a heartbeat; I just adore her.  She’s a woman who lives her life in gratitude and patience and kindness.  That’s Betty.

Any fun stories about her?

Well, a lot of the stuff is so personal, but I’ve got one.  She helped me name my animals.  For example, we were having trouble naming our dog, and she said, “What are you thinking of?”  And we’re like, “We love the moon, and she’s so sweet.”  And she says, “How about `Luna?’  `Mia luna’?”  We’re Italian, so it was perfect.  She named our first cat “Nelson” because she always wanted to name an animal after Nelson Eddy.

Your thoughts about your TV mom, Bonnie Franklin?

It was really hard being at her funeral.  She taught me so much.  Like how to use your voice and stand up for what you believe in, but with kindness.

Norman Lear?

Again, using your voice.  Treating others the way we want to be treated.  Norman’s a powerhouse.

Pat Harrington?

Pat Harrington made me laugh.  He was the funniest man.  He taught me timing.  That’s the gift he gave me.

Last question: “Valerie’s Home Cooking” aside, what other projects are on the burners?

My cookbook is coming out in October 2017: “Valerie’s Home Cooking.”  Otherwise, some things on Food Network, but nothing acting-wise yet.  In fact, hmm . . . that’s getting a little like, “Hey, guys, I still act!”

 

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SMALL BITES

What’s the last concert you attended?

Other than seeing Wolfie whenever he plays, I don’t go to concerts much, but I did see Pink.

Favorite concert ever – not counting your son or your ex?

Elton John at Dodger Stadium.

What songs do you keep on your phone?

I listen to Pink, Adele, Lady Gaga.  Mainly female artists.  And as soon as I get Wolfie’s new album, that’s all I’m gonna play!

What do you enjoy on TV?

I was watching Stranger Things for awhile, but then it got so strange!  I like Samantha Bee’s show a lot, Full Frontal.  She just cracks me up and gets me fired up.

Favorite TV show of all time?

Friends.  I think I’ve seen every episode.  Phoebe was my favorite character because she said things that people don’t normally say.  Ask her, “Can you help us with this?”  And she’d say, “Oh yeah, I wish I could, but I don’t want to.”  She was hysterical.

Favorite One Day at a Time episode?

Golly, that’s a hard one.  When Barbara breaks her nose.

Favorite Hot in Cleveland episode?
All of them.  Okay, it might be the one where Joy shoots her son.  We all took on these English accents and could barely get through the scene for laughing.

Favorite vacation spot?

My home.  When I just cook in my own kitchen and relax with my animals, that’s a vacation for me.  Unless, of course, you want to send me to Italy.  I’m good there, too.

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BYLINE:

David Lefkowitz co-publishes Performing Arts Insider (TotalTheater.com) and hosts Dave’s Gone By (davesgoneby.com) on UNC Radio. His play, The Miracle of Long Johns, won the best non-fiction script award at the 2015 United Solo Festival.

 

 

 

 

 

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NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY PROFILE: Kelli O’Hara on Living the Theater Life

Really Doing It – Kelli O’Hara on Living the Theater Life

(This article was published in Long Island Pulse, Dec. 2016: http://lipulse.com/2016/11/23/kelli-ohara-broadway/)

by david lefkowitz

 

Well, it sure took `em long enough.  In 2015, after five previous nominations for exceptional work in the Broadway musicals The Light in the Piazza, The Pajama Game, Nice Work if You Can Get It, South Pacific, and The Bridges of Madison County, Kelli O’Hara finally won her first Tony Award.  Choking back tears during her acceptance speech for playing Anna in The King and I, the actress, who had already left the production, promised, “I’ll be back!  Maybe not up here but on a theater stage.  I love what I do!”

As one of only a handful of true modern theater stars, O’Hara is bound to make good on that promise, even as the responsibility of raising two children with her husband, actor-musician Greg Naughton, holds first priority on her time and attention.  “We do the best we can,” the actress told Pulse.  “Some days it feels like we’re really doing it, and some days it feels really imperfect, but I think everybody feels that way no matter what business we’re in.”

Broadway, therefore, may not see O’Hara for another season or two, but the diminutive beauty can still make time in her schedule for some TV work (“Masters of Sex,” “The Accidental Wolf”) and concert engagements.  In fact, Long Island fans can see her Saturday, Dec. 10, at the Staller Center of Stony Brook University.  Similar to her October evening at Carnegie Hall, the program will mix originals and showtunes but in a way, the songstress explained, “that you might not expect.  There will be songs from the shows that I’ve done, but I’d do `This Nearly was Mine’ from South Pacific, as opposed to `Wonderful Guy,’ and `I Have Dreamed’ from The King and I as opposed to `Hello Young Lovers.’    Songs that represent the shows I’ve done but in ways that allow me to share other sides of myself.”

That self, O’Hara explained, was raised not on Broadway, but on movie musicals.  “I didn’t think of myself as wanting to be a movie star because the reality of my generation is that those movies weren’t being made anymore,” she explained.  “A movie star when I was a kid was Molly Ringwald.  But for me, it was Shirley Jones, Julie Andrews—my idol.  It was every movie I could get my hands on where someone was singing.  And when I started to dig into voices, I found myself wanting to know who Marni Nixon was.  Or learn about actresses like Marsha Mason in `The Goodbye Girl.’  Carol Burnett was a huge influence.  I’m not a comedian, but she was alive and full of everything that I loved.”

The actress even confided that when she auditioned for The Pajama Game, she offered a blatant imitation of Doris Day.  “I think I made the part my own later on, but just to get the part, I thought, `Well, I can do her, so here it comes.’”  And O’Hara’s Eliza in a 2007 New York City Philharmonic My Fair Lady?  “A complete homage to Julie Andrews.  And in other shows, there are personal people in my life that I channel, like both of my grandmothers and even my mother.  When you truly know someone other than yourself, it’s very useful to play a person you’re not.”

The kind of person O’Hara is could not be more grateful for her rare position among such top-tier Broadway divas as Laura Benanti, Audra McDonald, and fellow Oklahoma City University graduate Kristin Chenoweth (who helped O’Hara get her first agent).  However, she’s also realistic about her place in the showbiz hierarchy. “My goal will always be theater,” she said.  “But we have to be honest with ourselves.  Maybe a lot of people in New York know me on the Broadway stage, but when you’re talking about Americans coming here and buying tickets to see Broadway shows, they’d much sooner recognize a bigger star’s name.  I’m not silly; I understand how it works.  You’ll notice that I work a lot in the not-for-profit world.  It’s because commercial producers need to have that name.  And I’m not that name.  I’ve worked alongside Harry Connick Jr. and Matthew Morrison, and Matthew Broderick.  I’ve been lucky to have co-stars alongside me who are names.  So whether the theater community likes it or not, there’s pressure on all of us to go get TV and film credits in order to come back to theater and sell tickets.”

Asked if she ever considered packing it in during the lean times, O’Hara replied, “It’s hard for me to even admit this.  There were lots of times in my career when I paid dues and pounded that pavement.  I auditioned a lot of times, and there were a lot of things I didn’t get.  But I did win my first audition.  I came to New York on Thursday and auditioned for my first musical on Monday, and that was my first job.

“Times are different now,” she continued.  “I was a non-Equity actor and a blonde soprano, and I was going in for an ingénue role in a non-union production up in Sugar Loaf, New York, of Something’s Afoot—and I got it!  But it’s not like I came here and got a Broadway show right out of the gate.  I had a lot of heartbreaks.  But I had a lot of people helping me, and there was never a time I thought I’d give up because I had light at the end of every tunnel.  In fact, when I came to New York, I gave myself two years to get a Broadway show, and then I would go home.  Literally two years to the month, I made my Broadway debut, and I’ve never looked back.”

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BYLINE:

David Lefkowitz hosts Dave’s Gone By (davesgoneby.com) on UNC Radio, co-publishes Performing Arts Insider, and founded TotalTheater.com. His award-winning solo comedy, The Miracle of Long Johns (miracleoflongjohns.com), has played engagements in Colorado and New York City.

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NON-FICTION – FEATURE STORY PROFILE: Vanessa Williams – Inspired Every Day

VANESSA WILLIAMS: Inspired Every Day

by David Lefkowitz

(This article was first published April 2015 in Long Island Woman.)

How times have changed.  Before releasing sex tapes became a common shortcut to stardom, it was once considered embarrassing and career-ruining for an actress to be caught with her pants literally down.  Imagine that you’re Miss New York and then crowned Miss America, with the world at your feet, when suddenly a desperate moment from your past sneaks up on you.

That, of course, is what happened to Vanessa Williams in 1984, when Bob Guccioni of Penthouse magazine made a deal with a photographer who had taken nude pictures of the starlet two years earlier.   Williams sued for half a billion dollars but dropped the suit, and the pictures were published in an issue of Penthouse whose mocking, G-rated cover showed a publicity still of Miss America posing with George Burns.  Worse, the actress-singer – who received death threats just for being the first African-American pageant champ — was forced to resign, though she was allowed, technically, to keep her crown.

For the last seven weeks of that season, Williams’s throne was occupied by Suzette Charles, who went on to act in soap operas, do voice work, record a couple of singles in England, and raise two kids.  Meanwhile, you could say the deposed Ms. Williams had a bit more luck in the entertainment industry.   By 1988, she was releasing hit songs on the R&B and Billboard pop charts, and going triple platinum with her second album, “Comfort Zone.”

Further musical success led her to Broadway, where she followed Chita Rivera as the titular, bewitching Aurora in 1994’s Kiss of the Spider Woman.  “I didn’t have any trepidation taking the role,” Williams recalled in our brief, late-autumn phone conversation, “except that I had to hold a long B [note] at the end of `Where You Are.’  It was after a big dance number, and it was probably a good 16 counts, and I would just ask, Oh, jeez, how do you do it? How do you hold that note?’ And I was told, `You just gotta stand there and squeeze and blow.’  So on opening night, I held the note for eight counts and then went up the octave just to get extra breath, push through it, and definitely make it my own.

“It was a spectacular night,” continued Williams.  “I had all my friends and family in the audience that night to watch me do something I knew that I wanted to do my whole life.  That was fantastic.   But I was more excited and anxious to get rolling than fearful.  As a musical-theater major, I’d done a bunch of shows growing up, so to be on Broadway was a goal for all of us.”

It’s a goal that Williams has achieved thrice more, appearing as the witch in the 2002 revival of Into the Woods, and also torch singing last year as a guest star in the marvelous dance revue, After Midnight.  And then there was the 2013 revival of Horton Foote’s The Trip to Bountiful opposite Blair Underwood and Cicely Tyson.  “This was pretty much my second year with the show,” Williams recalled.  “We opened on Broadway.  Then we did the TV movie. Then we did L.A., and then just closed Boston.  I think we did 250 odd shows.  And Cicely was a marvel.  When we finished, she said, `I didn’t miss one.  I didn’t miss one.’  To be her age — ”

“Hey, what is her age?” I couldn’t help but interject, since Ms. Tyson’s true birthday is a secret kept even more closely than the formula for Coca Cola, with guesses ranging between the mid-seventies to ninety plus.  “So do you know how old she really is?”

“We kind of do, but we’re sworn to secrecy!” laughed Williams.  “She’s a marvel for her actual age, which is amazing.  And she inspired me every day.  She’s a strong, strong woman, even in terms of just her physical strength and her physicality.  Between her and Chita, just watching their work ethic, and the sheer stamina that these legends have – and their professionalism, it’s so inspiring.  The show starts – it might not start on time all the time, but it will start and it will finish — and it’s a true testament to being a professional.   That’s what I learned watching her. And also the love of the craft.  When you see people that are truly talented and know that’s their calling, that’s what inspires you and just reaffirms that `I’m doing what I should be doing.’

“You see the pure glee on Ms. Tyson’s face,” added Williams, “when everyone leaps to their feet for the standing ovation that she always gets every night.  We lift her up in the air off into the wings. And she says, `We did it.’  And she’ll kiss my hand and kiss Blair’s hand, and you realize that’s a job well done, but it’s also what fuels her.  That’s why we do what we do.  That’s why eight shows a week seems like a tough schedule, but we do it because the audience is there, and we’re giving them what they want, and we’re giving them more than they expected.  And that’s what I wanna be doing when I’m her age – whatever that age may be!”

In the meantime, what Williams is doing now is having fun being the spokesvoice for M&Ms – specifically one M&M, the dark chocolate Ms. Brown.  With the return of the crispy version of the dot-like candies, Mars, Inc. has called back “The Chief Chocolate Operating Officer” for a new promotional push.  “I love Ms. Brown, so I’m happy to be a part of it,” Williams offered.  “I don’t know where she got her PhD, but she’s very, very smart, and she runs everything in terms of the chocolate factory.  The character breakdown came through my agent saying they wanted her to be very smart and very dry, a la Wilhelmina Slater from Vanessa Williams in `Ugly Betty.’  So I said, `Why don’t you just use me?’  They had me in mind anyway, and I don’t know if they thought they couldn’t get me or something, but they got me.  I’m here.  And in terms of my career, it’s funny because a lot of adults know who I am, but when the young ones know that I’m the voice of Ms. Brown, all of a sudden, their eyes light up.  So now I’ve got some cachet in the younger market.”

Williams’s own younger self grew up in Westchester, though her family roots lie on Long Island.  “We did a piece on a show called `Who Do You Think You Are,’” recalled Williams, “and they traced all my Oyster Bay roots.  As far as we know it, our family goes back to 1842 on my dad’s side.  My great-great grandfather, David Carll, was born in 1842 in Cold Spring Harbor.  He grew up in Oyster Bay and got married to Mary Louisa Appleford in an interracial relationship back in 1863.  He was one of the first troops – colored troops – to sign up for the Civil War.  He went down, fought and came back.  Then he used his money to buy a house up on a hill which is still in the family – in fact, family members still live there.  We come from a long, proud tradition of Long Island families, all coming out of Oyster Bay.”

Grounded in middle-class suburban life, teenaged Williams studied piano and French horn before heading off to Syracuse University, an education interrupted by her pageant career but finished in 2008 when she completed her credits and graduated with a degree in Musical Theater Arts.  Post-fame acting roles included “Desperate Housewives,” the cult film “Harley Davidson and the Marlboro Man” and “Eraser” with Arnold Schwarzenegger.  Recalling her costar, Williams noted, “Arnold is a true leader.  He walks in the room, and everyone pays attention.  And that’s why, when he ran for governor, I thought it was a transition that was completely plausible and made sense to me.”

The actress had more measured words when asked about another icon, Bill Cosby.  No, she’s not one of his many accusers, but with his alleged sexual assaults so relentlessly in the news, it is impossible not to be curious about Williams’s opinion.  As she admitted in her 2012 memoir, “You Have No Idea,” when she was 10 years old, Williams was molested by an older female friend of her family.  As she told Oprah Winfrey in an interview, “One night [the friend] came into the room where my friend and I were sleeping, and she told me to lie down on the floor. She took my bottoms off and she said, ‘Be quiet,’ and she went down on me. I knew it felt good, but also something that was not supposed to be happening.”  For years, she kept quiet and suppressed the memory, which she regrets because it led to “the shame that was always haunting me.”

Which led us to the Cosby question.  “It’s horrible news that is coming to light – if this is all true,” Williams stated.  “It’s unfortunate that someone who has created such a good role model for so many people across the board – black, white – he was the role model on television.  To have this antithesis of what the image is and have all this other stuff come out is unbelievable, and I hope it’s not true and will go away.  It’s unfortunate for everybody.  I don’t know the statute of limitations and bringing things to trial . . . But I think he got the message very clearly, in terms of behavior and repercussions.”

Although Wikipedia notes that Williams’s ancestry is a mix of everything from Portuguese to African to Finnish to British, she does respond as a black woman to the longstanding troubles between police and the African-American community, a mutual mistrust that led last year to the unnecessary deaths of two unarmed blacks and the retaliatory slaying of two beat cops.  “There’s a friend who’s in my band that I’ve had since 1997,” Williams related.  “He’s my bass player, an accomplished musician from Ferguson, Missouri.  He studied at Berklee School of Music, and his daughter is a junior at Georgetown.   He’s an extraordinary musician and father and man.  He told me that every time he goes home, he’s pulled over.   He made a U-turn one time visiting home.  The police came up, pulled him out of the car, put him in shackles, locked him up for 24 hours and then let him go.  Without any kind of charge, any kind of explanation.  So when this all broke, I asked him, `You’re from St. Louis, Al, what do you think?’  He said, `I’m so happy there’s light shed on this issue.’

“This is something that is systematic, according to people that live there,” continued Williams.  “Unfortunately, it took this to shine a light on this system.  But that was my first-hand knowledge of somebody who I know personally who has had this happen time and time again.  For a man to be shackled for making a U-turn is ridiculous.”

Twice divorced, the mother of four children, and recently engaged to a retired accountant, Williams doesn’t shy away from topics other celebrities might consider controversial.  She’s a strong supporter of gay rights and marriage and has admitted to having an abortion as a teenager (“Being pregnant is the most frightening thing that happens in your life,” she told “Nightline.” “I knew in high school that’s something that I was not prepared to do, or fight, or struggle with.”) Williams has even owned up to using – gasp! — botox.  But she’s also earned the privilege of enjoying her success, or, as she told Oprah, “It’s my time to relax, explore and see what comes.”

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David Lefkowitz co-publishes Performing Arts Insider (TotalTheater.com), hosts Dave’s Gone By (davesgoneby.org) on UNC Radio, edits the theater section of Stagebuddy.com, and co-created Shalom Dammit! An Evening with Rabbi Sol Solomon (shalomdammit.com).

 

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